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*That Arthas managed to slay it is shunned at by most. "Even Arthas couldn't defeat an Old God by himself! That's ridiculous!" They say. First of all, Arthas had Ner'zhul's second-in-command, Anub'arak with him, and an army of undead. Second of all, that the three were weakened after centuries of imprisonment is very plausable
 
*That Arthas managed to slay it is shunned at by most. "Even Arthas couldn't defeat an Old God by himself! That's ridiculous!" They say. First of all, Arthas had Ner'zhul's second-in-command, Anub'arak with him, and an army of undead. Second of all, that the three were weakened after centuries of imprisonment is very plausable
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  +
(later added)
 
I can hardly beleive that the Forgotten one killed by Arthas is an Old God. Arthas didn't have "an army of undead" with him, he just had a dosen or two soldiers and was in a very weak state when they reached the Forgotten one (he was losing his powers). And remember that the Old Gods were able to fight with the Titans themselves. And how powerful the Titans really are? You can see from the fact that Sargeras ALONE was able to defeat Eredars and the Nathrezim EASILY. Thats including Archimonde and Kil'jaeden. So there's no way a pack of undead soldiers with two heroes (one of them very weak) was able to kill an Old God, even if he was in a weakened state (not to mention there is no proof that he really was in a weakened state). And C'thul was defeated by many HEROES, not ordinary units. Also there is a sugestion that C'thul was weakened because he was wounded by the Titans (they thought tey killed him), which doesn't mean that the other Old Gods are also weakened. So whatever that was there's no way it was an Old God.
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(to here)
   
 
The Forgotten One commanded the [[Faceless Ones]]. Rumors suggest that C'Thun also commands some Faceless Ones. Faceless ones may be a general name for Old God's most elitist minions.
 
The Forgotten One commanded the [[Faceless Ones]]. Rumors suggest that C'Thun also commands some Faceless Ones. Faceless ones may be a general name for Old God's most elitist minions.
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Another possibility is that the Forgotten One was created by C'Thun in his image, in an attempt to create an army to conquer the Nerubians, in order to re-join the old insectoid empire. The fact that Arthas managed to defeat this 'avatar' with relative ease supports this theory.
 
Another possibility is that the Forgotten One was created by C'Thun in his image, in an attempt to create an army to conquer the Nerubians, in order to re-join the old insectoid empire. The fact that Arthas managed to defeat this 'avatar' with relative ease supports this theory.
 
I can hardly beleive that the Forgotten one killed by Arthas is an Old God. Arthas didn't have "an army of undead" with him, he just had a dosen or two soldiers and was in a very weak state when they reached the Forgotten one (he was losing his powers). And remember that the Old Gods were able to fight with the Titans themselves. And how powerful the Titans really are? You can see from the fact that Sargeras ALONE was able to defeat Eredars and the Nathrezim EASILY. Thats including Archimonde and Kil'jaeden. So there's no way a pack of undead soldiers with two heroes (one of them very weak) was able to kill an Old God, even if he was in a weakened state (not to mention there is no proof that he really was in a weakened state). And C'thul was defeated by many HEROES, not ordinary units. Also there is a sugestion that C'thul was weakened because he was wounded by the Titans (they thought tey killed him), which doesn't mean that the other Old Gods are also weakened. So whatever that was there's no way it was an Old God.
 
   
 
== C'thun being killable by mortals ==
 
== C'thun being killable by mortals ==

Revision as of 15:18, 1 April 2007

Questionmark-medium
This article or section includes speculation, observations or opinions possibly supported by lore or by Blizzard officials. It should not be taken as representing official lore.


This article contains theories and speculation related to the Old Gods.

Creative inspiration

It is suspected that The Old Gods are partially based on the legends of the Great Old Ones and the Outer Gods, creations from the legend of Cthulhu written by H.P. Lovecraft.


The Imprisoned Gods' Location

  • It is possible that one of the imprisoned Old Gods is located beneath the Tirisfal Glades. When the high elves first landed on the Lordaeron continent, they encountered a strange force.

    Forging inland, the high elves founded a settlement within the tranquil Tirisfal Glades. After a few years, many of them began to go mad. It was theorized that something evil slept beneath that particular part of the world, but the rumors were never proven to be true.

  • Another theory is that one of the Old Gods is imprisoned in the Maelstrom, where he commands the naga. The naga, led by the monstrosity that was once Queen Azshara, were mutated from their night elf forms by the Old Gods at the formation of the Maelstom during the Sundering of the World.
  • The Arakkoa in Shadowmoon Valley are attempting to summon an Old God to Outland. Its model looks exactly the same as C'Thun's.
    • In the Warcraft novel Day of the Dragon, page 202 mentions a creature known as the Manta, Behemoth of the Deep. Krasus says it was "ten times the size and strength of a dragon." It was slain at least a century before the events of Day of the Dragon. It is possible this Manta is somehow linked to the Old Gods and the Naga.
  • It is possible that one of the three is imprisoned underneath Teldrassil due to the rapid contamination of the new world tree which is too fast to be just the fact that it has not been blessed by the dragons.
  • Some have speculated that one or more Old Gods may be responsible for the "Nightmare" invading the Emerald Dream.
    • THIS IS NOT SPECULATION** For the Ahn'Qiraj scepter quest chain, Malfurion Stormrage tells you that an old god "like the one you are trying to defeat" (so an old god other then C'thun) is corrupting the Emerald Dream. Also, during the Eranikus encounter, Eranikus makes reference to the one he is serving, an Old God. It is also possible that the "slain" Old God in The Master's Glaive may be the cause of the nightmare, being that instead of it being destroyed it merely shed it's physical form and entered the Emerald Dream after death.
  • More possible however, since the Old God in Darkshore was slain before the Emerald dream was even created, and would not have sat around waiting for several tens of-thousands years before deciding to corrupt the Emerald dream, and be the nightmare, is that the old god in Darkshore is utterly dead, in all forms, and that the nightmare is one of the imprisoned Old Gods.
  • Another source of contention is that nobody knows for sure how many of the Old Gods still exist. Due to its strong resemblance to C'Thun, many believe that the Forgotten One (see below) from Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne was an Old God. The Forgotten One was killed by Arthas, and now that C'Thun has been slain only two Old Gods would remain. As one is confirmed by in-game lore to be corrupting the Emerald Dream, only one location remains unknown. If so, then many of the other speculated areas for the location of an Old God are actually being corrupted by some other, unknown, entity. However, some think also The Forgotten One, and C'thun himself are just a part of the Old God, possibly it's eyes (Eye of C'thun)

So, we can then conclude from lore that:

1: One is dead in the Master's Glaive.

2: One is C'thun, slain in Ahn'Qiraj.

3: One is slain by Arthas in Azjol-Nerub

4: One is corrupting the Emerald Dream (this is confirmed to be the action of an Old God who isn't C'Thun.).

We can speculate that the the locations of the one corrupting the Emerald dream and the third imprisoned one are these, but it is unknown which is which:

1: One of them is still trapped in Tirisfal Glades: the large empty space on the left of the map indicates the site of a future instance.

2: One of them is under the Maelstrom, as indicated by lore.

It's probably that one corporeal form may lie in SE Azeroth. God #1 is in NW azeroth, God #2 is in NE, #3 in SW, #4 in the center. It would make sense that the fifth is in the SE, although this is only speculation.

Another theory on the locations of the Old Gods, and the Titan's reasoning when imprisoning them, that only involves three Old Gods, since the Titans thought the actually dead Old God as well as C'thun both dead, and then would have not bothered caring about them when imprisoning the three remaining ones, is that the Titans wanted to place the Old Gods as far away from each other as possible. Placing the Old three Gods as far away from each other as possible on Old Kalimdor, would, when the world was sundered place the Old Gods on one continent each. Regarding the rumours of Old-God prisons, this theory might be all wrong, but since Old Gods is a very misty subject with little real facts from Blizzard, it can still be consiered.

The Forgotten One

An ancient, terrible beast lay imprisoned beneath Azjol-Nerub, until Illidan's attempt to melt away the polar ice-caps surrounding Icecrown and crush Ner'zhul, accidentally broke the beast's prison. Before it could act. however, Arthas Menethil, Anub'arak, and a small army of undead nerubians crashed into its prison, and after a most epic battle, Arthas managed to slay it.

Many sources point toward the suggested fact that this "Forgotten one", as Anub'arak reffered to it, was in fact an Old God; one of the three imprisoned by the Titans. Here follow some:

  • When it comes to it's physical form, C'Thun is identical to it, and the glimpses of Old Gods in Knaak's "The War of the Ancients" are of huge tentacles, such as the ones of C'thun and the one in Azjol'Nerub. This hints that all Old Gods are multi-eyed, multi-mawed and tentacled, pink blobs in physical form. That the "Forgotten one" would have this appearence and NOT be an Old God is far-fetched.
  • It is very possible that the term "Forgotten one" is what nerubians call Old Gods in general. First of all, Anub'arak called it "a forgotten one", not "the forgotten one", which means there are several. Second of all, the sight of it scared the crap out of even the monstrous Anub'arak. So, we have an ancient, terrible evil creature that scares even the scariest of monsters, and there are more of it, and it has the appearence of an Old God, an appearence not shared by anything else known in the Warcraft universe. Would someone really oppose the contested fact that this is indeed an Old God?
  • That Arthas managed to slay it is shunned at by most. "Even Arthas couldn't defeat an Old God by himself! That's ridiculous!" They say. First of all, Arthas had Ner'zhul's second-in-command, Anub'arak with him, and an army of undead. Second of all, that the three were weakened after centuries of imprisonment is very plausable

(later added) I can hardly beleive that the Forgotten one killed by Arthas is an Old God. Arthas didn't have "an army of undead" with him, he just had a dosen or two soldiers and was in a very weak state when they reached the Forgotten one (he was losing his powers). And remember that the Old Gods were able to fight with the Titans themselves. And how powerful the Titans really are? You can see from the fact that Sargeras ALONE was able to defeat Eredars and the Nathrezim EASILY. Thats including Archimonde and Kil'jaeden. So there's no way a pack of undead soldiers with two heroes (one of them very weak) was able to kill an Old God, even if he was in a weakened state (not to mention there is no proof that he really was in a weakened state). And C'thul was defeated by many HEROES, not ordinary units. Also there is a sugestion that C'thul was weakened because he was wounded by the Titans (they thought tey killed him), which doesn't mean that the other Old Gods are also weakened. So whatever that was there's no way it was an Old God. (to here)

The Forgotten One commanded the Faceless Ones. Rumors suggest that C'Thun also commands some Faceless Ones. Faceless ones may be a general name for Old God's most elitist minions.

ForgottenOne

The Forgotten One

It is possible that the Forgotten One tried to do the same to the Nerubian Empire that C'Thun did to Ahn'Qiraj, but eventually failed.

SPECULATION:

It is possible that with this "forgotten one" is trans-dimensional, or by experiencing death was able to enter the Emerald Dream somehow, which would account for the only recent corruption of the Emerald Dream.

It could also be theorised that it is a "projection" of C'Thun, since the WC3 version looks incredibly similar and spawns tentacles to atttack. C'Thun could have attempted to influence control over both the Silithid and Nerubians at the same time to try and raise his army, but while the C'Thun managed to control the Silithid, the Nerubians (with their natural intolerance to mind control) were not swayed and the C'Thun projection was sealed away within the depths of Azjol'nerub. But that theory is based on C'thun using a projection-ability not mentioned anywhere else, and leaves another Old God unnaccounted for. It is then more probable that "The fotgotten one" was an Old God in his own right.

Or it could be that C'Thun was split during the Sundering, half going to Northrend and the other half staying in Kalimdor. This would explained for both forms weakness.

Another possibility is that the Forgotten One was created by C'Thun in his image, in an attempt to create an army to conquer the Nerubians, in order to re-join the old insectoid empire. The fact that Arthas managed to defeat this 'avatar' with relative ease supports this theory.

C'thun being killable by mortals

None of the following theories are actually required, but many people find it hard to swallow that, as with all bosses in WoW, mortals can kill an Old God because we are considered important heros and characters.

Killing C'Thun

The Titans managed to kill an Old God. The Old God in Darkshore was killed by the titans, really killed. The Titans thought they had killed C'thun when they left Azeroth. If the Titans thought they had killed C'thun, then he must have been struck with at least the power used to kill the one in Darkshore. C'thun did survive, but as the Titans thought they had killed him, it is indisputable that he was as mortally wounded as anything could be. This is where it gets interesting. Since C'thun was as near death as he was, it is possible that he afterwards wasn't really the Old God he was before. It is in fact, very possible that he was able to regenerate but a fragment of his former strength, after having been so significantly wounded by the Titans. If that is the case (and it probably is), then it would explain how mortals succeeded in defeating and killing him.

Killing Old Gods

It might be that killing of the Old Gods during the events of Warcraft and WoW (C'Thun killed/imprisoned in the War of the Shifting Sands, Arthas killing the Forgotten One (assuming the Forgotten One is an Old God) and warriors of the Alliance and Horde (players) killing C'Thun) can be achieved because the Old Gods were in a regenerative state, having been weakened by some previous conflict, and were just making their way back onto the world stage.

The Origin of the Silithid and Qiraji

Desolace

File:Goliaths.jpg

One of the two Goliath skeletons in Desolace.

In Desolace (a desolate area in Kalimdor), the massive corpses of two combatants lay forever facing each other on two sides of a grand valley. It has been speculated that these bones are either Old Gods or Faceless Ones, although they most resemble Nagas, despite their huge scale.

A Goblin named Hornizz Brimbuzzle in the Kodo Graveyard provides a quest that refers to these corpses as Dead Goliaths. The quest has nothing to do with the corpses. He just uses them as a landmark.

Old Gods and Expansion Speculation

If the theories mentioned above regarding the location of the Old Gods is true, then they would most likely be implemented one by one in various expansions. Check the Rumored Expansions for some of the possible settings for future expansions.

  • Perhaps, one Old God would be implemented in an in-game content patch, similar to C'thun, possibly in Tirisfal Glades, as evidence points this being the location of an old God. As stated earlier, the region west of Deathknell is large enough to support a large instance, similar to the southern parts of Silithus before the Ahn'Qiraj patch.
  • Another Old God would be implemented as the final boss for the Emerald Dream rumored expansion, as it is verified that an Old God is responisble for the Nightmare. Whether or not the players would kill a Dream Aspect of some sorts of the Old God, or his corporeal form (possibly still on Azeroth, "sleeping", or both, would have to be decided on. Although, Tigole made references in -03 to having "ran around" in the Emerald dream, indicating that th Emerald Dream is at least partly finished. However, that was several years ago, and there's no telling what's been continued on and what's not. It is also possible that the Emerald Dream won't be an expansion in it's own sense (Like The Burning Crusade), but rather part of a significant patch (Like Naxxramas in 1.11).
  • Finally, the third Old God would be found in the Maelstrom with the Naga, as it is also certifed that Highborne loyal to Azhara were turned into Naga by an Old God so they could survive the Sundering. It is likely they now serve the Old God, but it is also quite possible that they instead serve Neptulon.

The order in which these Old Gods were implemented would obviously depend on the order Blizzard released these rumored expansions.