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I changed the page around a bit to show guild progressions/crafters, will be adding to the links the stuff that was previously on the front page Melisinde 14:24, 13 September 2007 (UTC) Melisinde

Huuuuge scroll down to see the guild listing page, which is what the primary attraction of the WoWWiki is for players from other realms. I moved the notable characters into their own pages, still viewable easily just by clicking the links. Melisinde 00:48, 4 December 2007 (UTC)

Also for the love of god anyone who actually reads this, when you edit your guild in the progression table change it so it matches ><

Greatly Exaggerated Edit

Come to a consensus here please. Kirkburn  talk  contr 04:40, 4 December 2007 (UTC)

I've never set foot on the server and changed the note about lack of updates because Wowjutsu is pretty much the standard for tracking such things, but since I'm here, I'll weigh in and say that the note seems rather inappropriate. Let the table speak for itself; anyone familiar with the server will already have an opinion while anyone unfamiliar with it probably doesn't care. Nunuka 04:45, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
In fact, reading the statement again, it sounds like it belongs on the page about the guild in question if anywhere at all. Nunuka 04:47, 4 December 2007 (UTC)

I'll go ahead and post here with my thoughts as a guild leader of GE... basically there are a select few people on the realm who appear to be either jealous or just ill-hearted or whatever about the fact that we are progressing through T6 content. We are not the first guild formed from people who did not roll originally on this server; we won't be the last. That being said frankly an asterisk isn't worth the drama. The bigger issue is that some of the same people also have vandalized our guild page and said false things about our members. Just kinda lame overall. Techguyx 04:48, 4 December 2007 (UTC)

I've removed the note again. Ahtmenravi can discuss it here it he wants it added back. Nunuka, preferably leave the server to decide about where to find up to date listings please, though I agree about the note. :) Kirkburn  talk  contr 13:41, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
Our guild page is being edited by people now... apparently they're taking their issues to that page instead of this one... Techguyx 22:30, 4 December 2007 (UTC)

The previous note will remain on this page as it is a valid note. I have no bitter feelings or hostility towards anyone, I just want to reflect that until around August of this year there were no characters on this realm that were not rolled on it. This note belongs on the progression section because it reflects the abrupt change in server progression and explains how this was possible. It is only fair to mention that Greatly Exaggerated was formed on this server by transferred toons (100% of the other progression guilds rolled new characters on this server either when the server came live, or shortly thereafter). This is not a negative thing, just a part of Hydraxis history. I will post a thread on the server forums to get a "vote" by the progression guilds as to whether this note remains here or not. There are many more raiding guilds on this server with members who agree with my note than those who do not. People from other server who edit this page have no business doing so, they have no say. If the general consensus is that the note should have its own section, so be it. I do not agree that the guild page of Greatly Exaggerated is the only appropriate place for the note since the top progression guilds are all listed on the server page and server progression is the topic of the note. I believe that a majority of Hydraxians would agree to have this note. Ahtmenravi 19:02, 5 December 2007

On a related issue, I have not vandalized any page in the wowwiki. I have visited the <GE> page only once to read about them. I would never presume to edit a guild page other than my own. I resent being lumped into any category with reported vandals or with anyone who states false information. I have not lied about any of the information I posted, nor have I committed any vandalism. Ahtmenravi 19:43, 5 December 2007

I'll make one more comment and then leave it to the admins to decide but I've talked to many people who do NOT agree with Ahtmenravi's and KL's standpoint on this. He claims to speak for FAR more people than he actually does and he provides no evidence as to the validity of his claims otherwise. But in the end as I've said the asterisk isn't worth fighting over past that comment... so I'll leave it at that. Techguyx 04:55, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

I will gladly add this information to the "Hydraxis History" section and revise the note so that it is included therein. I didn't come from another server, I rolled my first toon on Hydraxis and have kept records of server events and progress since January. Also, for any moderator who decides it wise to manage server pages, and for Techguyx, I refer anyone who wants evidence of validity to my claims, to the official Hydraxis realm forums on the WoW website. Simply search for all entries containing "<GE>" or "Greatly Exaggerated" ("<Greatly Exaggerated>"). There you will find plenty of evidence to support my statements. The realm forums have been unnecessarily harsh to <GE> and it's members, but you will see the server has little sympathy for them. I wish for this note to be a neutral and honest addition that will inform new members of Hydraxis of it's history and make it aware to others who visit our page here the circumstances by which our server progression has been achieved. That's really all my intentions are here, I'm not trying to incite drama or be negative towards anyone or any guild. Unfortunately, since <GE> is currently the only major progression guild whose members did not roll originally on Hydraxis, they are the only guild for which an "*" is warranted. The asterisk denoted a note, and the note simply states the facts. If another guild should transfer here, then another convention should and will be adopted to reflect this. As stated earlier in my wall of text, I'll gladly create a new section and do away with the note as it is now. Maybe a "Legend" would be appropriate, stating something to the effect that ~"*guilds who have an asterisk next to their name either transferred to this server once server transfers opened or were created from characters who transferred to Hydraxis from other servers" & "Guilds with no markings by their names were guilds who were created by players who either re-rolled new characters on this server or who began playing WoW on Hydraxis". Thoughts? Ahtmenravi 01:02, 6 December 2007

If you really want evidence that this is a waste of your time and that most people don't give half of the care that Ahtmenravi continues to claim you still need look no further than the fact that he is the only person on this website, and we are one of the only servers in the world, that feels the need to distinguish between "pure" guilds and "non-pure" guilds over a year after a server launch. Funny how he finds it necessary to distinguish only when his guild is overtaken. Techguyx 12:30, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

Ahtmenravi claims that he speaks for the majority of the server when that is most definitely not true. I am the only member in GE that rolled my toon on the server when it opened. As such, I have developed strong bonds with a good number of players on the server. NOT ONE of them holds the same stance as Ahtmenravi and some members of his guild, Kalimdors Legion. Additionally, it is often claimed that the 'majority' of the horde side feels the same way which again, is not a factual argument as we have not only had members of KL post on our forums that they support us but have had a number of GMs from leading horde progression guilds message us and state that KL and it's members DO NOT represent the majority opinion horde side. Despite claims to the contrary this is an attempt to incite drama and as Kirkburn spoke to above, people on the server know us and those outside of it won't care. In summary, the claims being made by Ahtmenravi that the majority of the server support this is completely false and given that admins have already removed the note several times, the burden is on him to prove otherwise which he has not done in any satisfactory and diplomatic way. Breklin 8:30, 6 December 2007

The only reason I feel the need to mention it now.....is a simple matter. I was sick and unable to play WoW from about the end of August until the end of November. I am only now able to read and write again well enough and think clearly enough to articulate my thoughts in writing. If I had not had brain issues, I would have done it in August. I don't speak for anyone but myself on this matter, by the way. I have asked many people in game and it has become my opinion that everything I've stated above is true. When I ask people, or see things mentioned in /general chat, I take note. I have yet to see support for this guild's stance. I will figure out a way to make this "drama free". Breklin, I am not doing this to incite drama. I am not doing this because you are the #1 progression guild. I would have created a note like this if <GE> were #15 on progression. I haven't been able to raid with KL for months now, and remain simply a backup on the raid roster. KL is a casual raiding guild and, I personally, don't consider other guilds progress to be competition. I challenge you to find anyone who says something bad about me. I am an honest, God loving, kind person. I have personally logged onto Alliance toons and spoken to your members on nights where you have had progression kills. I congratulated you on /general on both horde and alliance side. I have never "flamed" your guild or spoken badly about you to or with anyone, publicly or privately. I'm finished defending myself. Simply because other realm progression tables elect not to mention transfers, does not make it a "rule". By the way, this server isn't even a year old yet....server transfers have only been available here for 4 months. I give you my word that I will listen to suggestions about this note, and make the necessary changes. Ahtmenravi 13:35, 6 December 2007

You sound like a nice person, but I don't think that justifies putting up a note about a guild that's not your own. the members of GE are people too, I think their wishes deserve a little respect. I don't feel that the note is necessary, it doesn't affect progression, and this is after all, a game. My 2 cents anyway. Honestly I don't know anyone else that's for keeping the note up. Arlena 14:00, 6 December 2007

Seeing as I always strive to be a polite and model player for the rest of the server population. I feel that the " * " and note is needed simply because they were a transfer guild, and have even had characters from their old server that they left a guild because it was number 5 in progression. I also don't like seeing these fabricated truths GE is trying to shove into everyones face, go unchallenged. Sure it may be a majority of GE posting here, but that's only because they're a hardcore raiding guild who trolls forums all day, as can be seen by the continuous drama related to their threads on the realm forums. If the note really didn't mean anything then they wouldn't care, they're just against it because they're petty jealous fools who like to incite drama. Bustycops 20:26, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

As of this time I think the reaction on the realm forums speaks for itself. The majority of respondents wish to see the note taken down and I believe their opinions should be respected. Bustycops, your comment is nothing more than libel and devoid of any real argument beyond your misguided personal opinion. Thank you Ahtmenravi for making the comments you did and explaining your argument. Let's leave this drama be and get back to playing what is, after all, a game.Breklin 16:45, 6 December 2007

This is obviously something people are passionate about, but given that it seems apparent that most (here and on the forums) want the note removed, it shouldn't stay. The wiki is not for drama, and it certainly isn't for trying to correct perceived injustices. The most I would see as acceptable in this case is a note saying "transfer guild", but even that may not be appropriate. Kirkburn  talk  contr 00:03, 7 December 2007 (UTC)
While I don't agree with moderators directly editing server pages, I will concede that at this time removing the note is the best course of action. Ahtmenravi 20:26, 6 December 2007
We're here to mediate disputes. Preferably we'd not have the disputes in the first place, but someone has to stop things turning into insult-slinging matches. :) I don't like editing server pages either. Kirkburn  talk  contr 16:51, 7 December 2007 (UTC)


Why after 2 months of this topic being dead are we back to posting the same drivel? Paccoco

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