Talk:Celestial

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Interesting thing of note about Celestials besides being the fact it might be a partial fix to the belief systems of the Clerics of Northshire abbey in Warcraft 1 manual, is that it also seems to imply that their may have been some Orcs that made it to Azeroth before the opening of the Dark Portal by some means. This might leave the opening for the possibility of Gorona's "half-human" heritage to be fixed as well. Only time and Metzen will tell. (unsigned, posted 02:32, 10 April 2006 User:Baggins)

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I would hold this information with a grain of salt. I have the Warcraft I Manual and there is zero info of celestials or angels. Consider this Celestial entry a hoax. (unsigned, posted 04:29, 17 April 2006 User:Caroldanvers)

I believe the source for this article was the Manual of Monsters RPG book. I've made this clear in the article, please correct it if wrong. The Warcraft I manual does indeed mention God and archangels; see for example the description of the cleric spell Holy Lance: "As the archangels took up swords of light to defend the heavens..." I've changed the heading of the section discussing Warcraft I to make it clearer that the reconciliation is speculative only. --Aeleas 00:41, 17 April 2006 (EDT)

you are correct Aeleas. Yes while it may be partially written to reconcile warcraft 1 material, we don't know for sure, so yes its is more speculative in nature. We'd have to ask the authors to know for sure.Baggins 00:53, 17 April 2006 (EDT)

Dungeons and Dragons Origin

Celestials are of Dungeons and Dragons origin and do not fit into the Warcraft Universe. In Dungeons and Dragons, Celestials are a force of "good" which battle the "evil" demons. Dungeons and Dragons has a clear definition of good and evil which the Warcraft Universe does not have. For example, many of the games heros are really amoral anti-heros: Illidan, Maiev, Sylvanas and Arthas. Another factor which makes the Celestial non-canon is its origin from another plane. In Dungeons and Dragons, there exist a myriad of planes. This is not the case in the Warcraft Universe. Wizards of the Coast, the producer of Dungeons and Dragons, had a limited understanding of the Warcraft Universe and just added the Celestial in the mix to appease their fan base of old-school RPGrs. Celestials should not be considered canon.-- User:TopDread 01:38, 14 May 2006 (EDT)

That is your opinion(you have right to that opinion), and its duely noted. However it has not been stated by blizzard and must be left out of the topic to maintain Neutral Point of View. The RPG warning is in place to warn people who may choose to ignore the RPG. Going by the game is a bad sense of scale as well based on the fact that the world is only the size of a small town in the middle california, its incredibly unrealistic world(you don't see every character that was ever established in other games and novels in that world), nor do you see every character or location that shows up in the spinoff literature.

However according to metzen;

We're taking the process of building a world seriously and it wasn't just churned out. It had a strong sense of continuity. We've always tried to do that with are ancillary products like the D&D line and our novels. We are kind of painstakenly anal, about making sure all the details add up, that continuity is held to be sacred. So that no matter in what medium you are experiencing warcraft it all feels like a contiguous experiance."

-Chris Metzen, World of Warcraft, Behind the Scenes DVD.

The description that we have received Naaru, are quite similar to that of the Celestials. So imo they do fit. However for sake of NPOV I must leave out my opinion or anyone's opinion, and they can discuss there thoughts in here. Also you knowledge of the RPG books are flawed, they state specifically that there are not any of the planes as there are in DnD, in pretty much every single book, those were carefully left out on purpose. When they refer to planes, they are referring to the known places such as Elemental, Twisting Nether, Emerald Dream, Great Dark and Titan controlled planets, or are simply cultural belief systems that likely have no actually basis in reality. Baggins 01:45, 14 May 2006 (EDT)

...Baggins 01:38, 14 May 2006 (EDT)

Wouldn't it be possibly that the terms "Celestial" and "Hopes" has been used to describe emissaries of the Holy Light, and that there are more emissaries than the naaru? Perhaps the naaru are the same as hopes (I think they sound very much alike), but humans and draenei have given them different names; or that hopes and naaru are closely related, and both are some kind of celestial. Does this seem plausible? --Oponyxal 13:54, 1 October 2007 (UTC)

While my knowledge of the Warcraft universe is probably very limited compared to the people here I would like to ask why everyone says..."The light Is a nonthiestic religion so this cannot be right" Naaru act as emmisaries of the light so why cant Hopes and Celestials just be other emisaries? There IS a spirit rezzer angel...so maybe its possible these are related. Or maybe theyre even manifestations of the light. Elune is a goddess so just because the races who practice the light dont worship or necessarily acknowledge a god doesnt mean there isnt one. --Uiemad 14:05, 17 October 2007