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This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Highborne article.

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Irrelevant joke Edit

I have an irrelevant joke for you!

Q:What is a Highborne's favorite socal hangout?

A: The Dire Mall. --SWM2448 20:13, 2 May 2007 (EDT)

XD  IconSmall Gnome Male Ibbert T/C 23:15, 2 November 2007 (UTC)

OMG... It really hurts. Shaera 15:02, 18 December 2007 (UTC)

High Priest Thel'danis Edit

High Priest Thel'danis coul be Highborne... that is very likely... anyone having something to say about that? Because then he would be notable... Tomb of Uther's guardian and all that... maybe... ? --The Lich KingPetitiongossipiconVendorgossipicon-Battlemastergossipicon 13:53, 18 December 2007 (UTC)

Ya its very telling that he's supposed to be a high elf according to lore, but has the appearance of a night elf. That is pretty much the definition of Highborne. I'd recommend him being added to the list, but with the (presumed) tag next to it.Baggins 23:05, 18 December 2007 (UTC)

OK

O.o Nice icons, did Varghedin make them? --The Lich KingPetitiongossipiconVendorgossipicon-Battlemastergossipicon 13:59, 8 January 2008 (UTC)

Yes.Baggins 17:35, 8 January 2008 (UTC)

Mounts and Languages Edit

I doubt they had Dragonhawks or elven horses...Or that they speak Thalassian.--Gurluas 20:26, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

Locations of other Highborne Elves Edit

I have found 2 or maybe 3 Highborne working at the Darkmoon Faire near Stormwind city. They fit the description of Highborne in that they look exactly like Nightelves but are much smaller, smaller than a human in fact. I took a pic of the two "sisters" But I was unable to upload it and anyway I believe the pic's size is wrong for the WOWWiki wonder if someone who is skilled in taking pics for the Wiki could snap a shot of these Highborne at the faire? Magnumswift (talk) 17:06, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

I'm almost positive those are mere night elves, as very few Highborne still exist in the world, and none of them would stoop so low as to do carnival work. When the Well of Eternity exploded, most of the Highborne fell into the sea and were transformed into the naga. Of those that remained, most integrated with the night elves, and most of THAT group went on to become the high elves. The only known group of Highborne still existing in the world are the Shendralar Ancients in Dire Maul, and most of them are dead. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 20:02, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

Not too accurate? Edit

In War of the Ancients, there was a group called the Moon Guard, which used arcane spells and were not Highborne.

Also, Illidan used arcane magic constantly, and yet he remained a night elf. I don't think the "speciation" occurred until after this article indicates. Kimera757 (talk) 02:08, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

Well, first off the change is subtle, physically they appear exactly the same race. Although the nobles themselves are considered a seperate racial line within the elven species. The differences are largely moot since both were grouped as a whole under night elves. This is more of an ethnicity issue (yes the use of the term race is probably not the best term that people should use).
The thing about the speciation information is that different sources may give conflicting information (thus citations are necessarily to point out that difference). Note, that Shadows and Light and War of the Ancients trilogy were written about the same time by different authors (Metzen was one of the ones in charge of both). Its unclear why the authors may have such different lore opinions. However, while those sources say they are seperate racial lines, they are also lumped together under the same group/species more or less, "night elves" in those same books. Note: That this isn't exactly clear either since authors tend to lump the terms species and race with the same definitions, using the terms interchangeably (but it depends on the author I suppose).
It also seems that while its true for some night elves, not all night elves necessarily change from use of magic (it seemed it mostly only occured with the upper class). It also depends on how the arcane magic was accessed (the class of the caster). For instance a runecaster (or similar caster types) accesses arcane by other means than a sorcerer, wizard or mage. Runecasters tend to avoid the corruption associated with arcane magic by accessing magic through more natural means. The difference seems to depend on if one's access to the arcane goes against nature, rather than working with nature. This difference may explain why a druid or shaman might have spells that are arcane in nature, but be a traditional arcane caster, and more into nature magic.Baggins (talk) 19:16, 15 August 2008 (UTC)

Highborne versus High ElvesEdit

Why are we including the references to High Elves as the name of Highborne when they are two seperate things now? A page already exists for High Elves. Doesn't the connection between Highborne and High Elf end after they left Kalimdor and became the Queldorei when they landed in the new continent? Rolandius Paladin (talk - contr) 03:13, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

Not sure what the problem is, the sentence in question is referring to the word "Quel'dorei" only, and is noting that it has different meanings in Darnassian and Thalassian. --Ragestorm (talk · contr) 03:17, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
Well the thing is that it should be on the High Elves page and not this page. One of "Quel'dorei's" translations is High Elf not Highborne. Rolandius Paladin (talk - contr) 03:28, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

Point of note many of the High elves consider themselves "Highborne", and quel'dorei means "highborne" even in their language. On the rerverse there are Highborne that are called high elves. Vice versa and all that.Baggins (talk) 03:34, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

According to WoWWiki, doesn't quel'dorei means "high elf" or "children of noble birth" and not "highborne". Rolandius Paladin (talk - contr) 04:11, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
It means three, depending on which source you refer to.Baggins (talk) 04:15, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
If quel'dorei means both highborne and high elf, technically there is no difference between a high elf and a highborne right? Rolandius Paladin (talk - contr) 04:19, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
Well the average "remaining" Highborne still looks like a night elf physically... Generally speaking the physically high elves, drop the "quel'dorei" moniker and are more commonly referred to just by high elves, but may still consider themselves of the Highborne on a philosphical level. But there are certainly physical differences between the two. Please don't try to think too hard on this you'll hurt your head, :p.Baggins (talk) 04:21, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
LOL okay. Rolandius Paladin (talk - contr) 04:26, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
Actually, The highborne which lives in the continent of kalimdor and the areas of the nightelves are trying to like raw moon magic and trying to stop there thirst for arcane magic, and they still maintain there white hair and night elven height. On the other hand, The other highborne made there own language because they don't want to look back in there exile of darnassian territory and change they're darnassian name highborne to highelves and made the language, Thalassian. They also changed in height when they haven't got the well of eternity's arcane raw power. Thirst for arcane magic, they are forced to move city by city, country by country. Until they cannot move onward more. They found themselves refuge in an island which is still untitled, when they move closer and closer through the unfamiliar island, they were ambushed by forest trolls. They survived the ambush and made there new race, and started a new life, called high elf. Though the highelves still needs arcane magic. Dath'remar Sunstrider made a well in the place where the sun rises, poured the vial of water from the well of eternity, and made the sun well. With they're new dicovery. They stop worshiping the moon and started worshiping the sun.After what they have gone through they called the island Quel'Thalas after there name which means the sun-blessed, and called there capital "Silvermoon City" --Akia.clemente (talk) 09:14, April 11, 2011 (UTC)

Undead Highborne SpiritsEdit

Should this page reference the various Highborne undead that can be encountered in Darkshore, Azshara and Winterspring (just off the top of my head)? These are easily the most common occurrence of Highborne in the game - as revenant spirits. If they merit inclusion, I will endeavor to track down all in-game occurrences in World of Warcraft but there are parts of Northrend I have yet to see. Jubaal (talk) 01:27, September 14, 2009 (UTC)

New comments should be on the bottom please. I would like to see that in the article, if you can do it, add them. Benitoperezgaldos (talk) 01:42, September 14, 2009 (UTC)
Done on at 06:35, October 17, 2009 TherasTaneel (talk) 17:13, November 4, 2009 (UTC)

Joining the Alliance?Edit

"although they are about to rejoin the kaldorei in Teldrassil, thereby joining the Alliance." Just because they offer their "knowledge and skill" doesn't mean nessesarily they are joining, just that they are lending their aid. The Arakkoa or Ethereal haven't joined either the Alliance nor Horde. They lend their aid to their own ends, usually to gain something or simply staying alive. TherasTaneel (talk) 14:29, October 15, 2009 (UTC)

Guess we'll see when the storyline is complete.User:Coobra/Sig4 04:58, October 16, 2009 (UTC)
In this case though, TherasTaneel, we have the benefit of knowing there will be night elf mages in Cataclysm. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 06:36, October 16, 2009 (UTC)
So,...the high elves of Quel'Thalas taught the humans of Arathor magic in exchange for support against the trolls of Zul'Aman (see: Troll Wars). Then they "pledged an oath of loyalty and friendship to Thoradin and his bloodline." It wasn't before "Alleria brought the head of a freshly slain troll warrior to the Convocation of Silvermoon, throwing it at Anasterian's feet" that the elves went into a Alliance,...and quickly withdrew once the horde were defeated and the dark portal closed. Why then, should the highborne enter a full fledged alliance with the night elves of Darnassus? TherasTaneel (talk) 11:41, October 16, 2009 (UTC)
The night elves took some of their money eight thousand years ago and the Highborne want it back. The humans (probably Jaina Proudmoore in this case) were like, "come on be nice. We have mages and you like us. Give them their money back.". --Super Bhaal (talk) 16:47, October 16, 2009 (UTC)
The high elves and the highborne are not the same people. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 17:38, October 16, 2009 (UTC)
I know, that wasn't my point; they are both elves, hence probably have the same social codes and they both need favors, but that doesn't nessesarily make them jump into any part of an alliance. TherasTaneel (talk) 18:28, October 16, 2009 (UTC)
The highborne and high elves probably have very different social codes, actually (high elves and night elves certainly do), but the new NPCs and quest that were added in 3.2.2 definitely give the impression that they're looking to rejoin their brethren after almost ten thousand years of exile. Because unlike the high elves, the highborne are still night elves. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 18:39, October 16, 2009 (UTC)
When I said that they had the same social code, I meant when the caste Highborne traveled overseas and founded Quel'thalas and became high elves, can we agree they were much alike Then? The reason the high elves are even in this discussion is just to show that elves that consider themselves superior arn't likely to throw themselves into an alliance unless absolutely nessesary. All I'm saying is that "I have traveled from the dust and ruin of the past to come to an accord. The time may soon come when the kal'dorei require the knowledge and skill we have to offer." is abit loose to base the statement to a commitment to a full fledged alliance. But sure, if so, why not add them to the Alliance-aligned section of the Alliance article? TherasTaneel (talk) 19:22, October 16, 2009 (UTC)
I don't know where this "uncertainty" comes from. That parallel with the high elves brought up, is shaky to say the least. There are still no playable high elves in the game. With night elves gaining the possibility to play and train mages, highbornes are "rejoining the kaldorei society at large" (in their own words). The kaldorei are strongly committed to the Alliance. Therefore, the highborne will become part of the Alliance.IconSmall BloodElf2 MaleAMBER(RΘCK) 18:06, October 18, 2009 (UTC)
Who says "rejoining the kaldorei society at large"? TherasTaneel (talk) 18:12, October 18, 2009 (UTC)
Strange, I remember either Mordent Evenshade or Daros Moonlance saying this, but it turns out that particular phrase was added to the Highborne article by Ragestorm. So, I was wrong on that. However, both Mordent and Daros have said other things which mean the exact same thing:
  • "The time may soon come when the kal'dorei require the knowledge and skill we have to offer." (Mordent)
  • "My colleague set out for Darnassus to speak with the High Priestess there, that we might come to an understanding." (Daros)
  • "Whether the residents of this young tree come to accept us or not, the Highborne are returning to light" (Daros)
Does that make sense? IconSmall BloodElf2 MaleAMBER(RΘCK) 18:38, October 18, 2009 (UTC)
It does make sense, but I still find it too vague. I'd like to have it added, when we know for certain, somewhat as coobra says "Guess we'll see when the storyline is complete." That seem to be how its usually done, but if anyone feels differnt, I won't stop them, but if so, I would encourage that they will be added to the Alliance-aligned section of the Alliance article too. TherasTaneel (talk) 18:50, October 18, 2009 (UTC)
The Highborne rejoining the night elves is hinted at by Mordent and Daros; this is likely meant to be an in-universe explanation for night elf mages in Cataclysm. It is true that nobody's stated they'll be joining the Alliance, but it would be difficult for them not to if they were returning to the night elves- which, I'll admit, has not been quite confirmed. --Ragestorm (talk · contr) 20:46, October 18, 2009 (UTC)

Image Edit

I think it neeeds a new image. That one is kind of cartoonish and doesn't display the Highborne properly. BobNamataki 10:27, November 4, 2009 (UTC)

Tall, arrogant-looking, pointy-eared, over-dressed, and carrying a weird-looking weapon? Check, all. I say keep it up. --Super Bhaal (talk) 12:46, November 4, 2009 (UTC)
It's the image Blizzard use in their "Warcraft Encyclopedia".[[1]] TherasTaneel (talk) 16:31, November 4, 2009 (UTC)

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