Talk:Infinite Dragonflight

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Contents 1 The Old Gods up to their old tricks? 2 A Dragon Did It 3 Speculation: Deathwing 4 Alignment 5 Another theory about creation 6 The 6th flight? 7 Not actually dragons? 8 Speculation: Deathwing 9 An abberation of the netherwing perhaps? 10 The Secret Master of the Flight 11 Theory of the Infinite Dragonflight's Creation 12 Mt.Hyjal and Dark Portal 13 Could the master be Sargeras or Kiljaeden? 14 Could the master be the (dead?) C'thun or maybe a person over any suspicion? 15 At some point they're not that evil? 16 Archimonde 17 Salandria 18 ALLIANCE WITH THE BLACK DRAGONFLIGHT? 19 Another Flight 20 Mechanical History 21 War of the Ancients Insight

The Old Gods up to their old tricks?

I'm wondering...Are the old gods behind this again? It's likely, and if, they appear to corrupt/mess with one dragon flight after the other. Black first, then green and now bronze...And further, could it be the infinite flight was created by (ab)using Nefarian's chromatic flight?

It could be the Old Gods, but my bet is on the Burning Legion or some other group interested in completely wiping out Azeroth. In pretty much all the scenarios we fight in, if the Infinate Dragonflight wins, the Burning Legion will eventually destroy the world. I'm not sure how much the Old Gods would benefit from that. For the same reason, it seems unlikely that Nefarion is behind this as well. btw pls sign your posts. --Mikaka 15:30, 3 December 2006 (EST)

mnn, I thought it like this: In the WoA-Trilogy it appears the old gods were near to escape using the Well of Eternity, but that connection to the mortal world broke as the well went boom. The 'new well' later then was said not to alter in any way, and therefor perhabs become a new gateway for the old gods, as long as the tree stands. Now Nordrassil has been damaged and therefor the well might have been altered slightly...far enough to allow the three a minor access into the mortal world and everything connected with the tree. One of them could have went into the Emerald dream abusing the tree's 'green matrix', another could have abused the 'bronze' matrix to get into the caverns and perhabs even to blackrock on the essences of the kidnapped bronze dragons...--Maibe 19:03, 3 December 2006 (EST)

Judging by the name of the expansion, it could very well be the Burning Legion, without a doubt. They're known for travelling through rifts, so the caverns of time, and the emerald dream, are both perfect vessels for them. However, I'm hoping this infinite dragonflight is a whole, seperate faction-type deal. But the liklihood of them being totally independent from Legion or Old God influence is probably pretty slim, lol. --Magnus 19:23, 10 December 2006 (EST)

Mnn...but seeing the flight wants to stop Medivh from Opening the Portal...I doubt that would be what the legion wants...--Maibe 08:10, 12 December 2006 (EST)

Without the orcs coming to Azeroth, no one would know about Kalimdor. Then, when the burning legion come at the same time of WCIII, the only army there to stop them will be the Night Elves, the humans and the orcs being absent (the orcs never coming to this planet and the humans not knowing about Kalimdor) they would be destroyed and the legion would take over the planet. Omacron 18:33, 25 January 2007 (EST)

You're know that the second time it rather was the humans' and highelves' use of magic that interessted the legion in Azeroth again? Not the well underneath Nordrassil as it was hidden form the legion's eyes by dragonic magic. Without the humans and highelves using magic, the legion, most-likely, wouldn't have had any interest in Azeroth anymore. So the second coming is not the nightelves' fault. And, as you might remember, Archimonde in WC3 was summoned in Dalaran. And that via a spell from the book of Medivh. Aside from that, as we know Sargeras was in Medivh all along. Long story short: The legion's lords need someone to summon them. The highborne did that before the sundering. Sargeras plan was to first use Medivh to get the orcs to Azeroth and destroy and weaken the forces in the eastern kingdoms and then use him again to summon forth the other major demons (Kil'Jaeden, Archimonde etc). and now, before I lose it completely, I stop in hope you understand that no matter how you look it, it can't be in the legion's interest to keep Medivh/Sargeras from opening the portal...--Maibe 20:41, 25 January 2007 (EST)

It could be the legion's doing, though not intentionally. Look at the furbolgs: they've been corrupted by the legion, but don't necessarily serve them. Perhaps this is the case with the infinite Dragonflight: they're corrupted Bronze dragons. And they, like the furbolgs, are now their opposite: like the peaceful furbolgs who are now raging and warlike, the infinite dragonflight are destroying time where once they maintained it. --gamerxl 20:19 January 31st, 2007 (EST)

The Infinite Dragonflight are reffered to as a "rouge" dragonflight, to me that makes it seem like their supposed to be former Bronze dragons, that's only my opinion, but it dosen't answer how their color suddenly changed from bronze to black and dark grey. Hordesupporter 18:39, 28 January 2007 (EST)

If they truly were a 'rouge' element, then I would expect them to be a bit red about the cheeks.  Kirkburn talk contr 18:46, 28 January 2007 (EST)

The idea that they are former Bronzes also won't answer why they have dragonspawn with them, since dragonspawn are absolutly loyal to the dragonflight, not just a few specific dragons. Hordesupporter 18:01, 1 February 2007 (EST)

Although it hasen't been revealed exactly who the infinite dragonflight answer to, once a group defeats the Epoch Hunter he yells "No! The master will not be... pleased!" Which indicates that they can't be serving the old gods, (maybe a single specific old god) and they can't serve the burning legion eiter, because that would mean they have multiple leaders, not a single one. Hordesupporter 19:33, 14 March 2007 (EDT)

It doesn't have to mean anything. He could refer to whoever was directly above him in IDF hierarchy. --Lilianne Blaze 22:35, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

I speculate that maybe Nozdormu himself is responceable for the infinite dragonflight for some reason, possiby to change his unavoidable death that the titans showed him somehow. It fits: one leader, dragonkin loyal, power over time, and he IS missing... The User:Magnusjohanlsn/Beetalbare, The Corrupted Shard of Aman'Thul's Rod rumor, though old, may not be far off.--Sandwichman2448 16:31, 31 March 2007 (EDT)

Well if you ask me the dragonflight is doing stuff that is helpfull for the old gods. Both event's that they try to interupt lead to the creation of the new horde. Without a horde at all in Azeroth there would be no alliance. And without Thrall no New horde. Why would that help the Old Gods? No one of them would have meet the Nelfs, and with that only the Nelfs would have been able to fought Cthun and his army in Silithus. (Keilden 03:11, 7 May 2007 (EDT))

the old gods are smart. Specualtion only but if Illidan is somehow lending his power to old gods for their gain, he had no idea. if they wiped out azeroth, who would be there to stop them? Titans are gone for now and theyre free to run about. ya, its hard to do with little info but look at a larger picture. weakened life on azeroth means easy conquering. Azshara is their biggest pawn and im sure theyd make short work of Arthas.

Alright, If the Portal Wasn't opened... The Horde would never come, Alliance never formed, Legion come, Kill Tree... But even so... Medivh would DIE, so even if Thrall escaped he wouldnt know to come to Kalimdor, and even the Night elves wouldnt be-able to hold them back for Malfurions trap to be set...

If Thrall had not escaped, The Horde would never have been formed but Medivh would still try to contact him possibly... I suspect the "Easter Eggs" in Old Hillsbrad is the key, such as Kel'thuzad...

Now the Old Gods are probably behind this... If the Legion Came they would go and Siphon the World Tree, but it was stated that Archimonde wanted the power to himself... Possibly the Old Gods 'used' Archimonde for their schemes, With the World Tree's Power being drained the Protections that the Dragonflights placed would also disperse, allowing for the Old Gods to possibly use the Well... --Shiniki 07:23, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

A Dragon Did It

Hmm, just to put this out here. I've just realized that Blizzard has created the perfect excuse for any retcons that occur in Warcraft. They can just blame it on the Infinite Dragonflight messing around with history. Mr. peasant 13:53, 23 March 2007 (EDT) We already have a few retcons, first, Thrall escaped because fires went out in 5 buildings, although Taretha only set 1 in the original timeline, also note that now Medivh was protected from attackers as he opened the dark portal, and it looks like the Scourge and the Legion will be reinforced by dragons during Mt. Hygal now. Hordesupporter 15:19, 30 March 2007 (EDT)

actually...you both missed a very important part about the caverns: I think In durnholde the bronze dragon even states that, after the players finished everything, he'll alter the memory of Thrall and Tari and everyone else so they will remember the events as they should have happened (see Lord of the clans for detail), medivh/sargeras most likely is willing not to tell anybody. We will have to see how Mt Hyjal will be, but one thing is clear: Blizzard will most unlikely use CoT to retcon stuff, as the bronze dragon will always alter the NPCs memories so they will remember things as they should have happened. An exception might be the instance behind the ship, as the two dragons in fornt of it say the infinite flight succeded here. But that could also mean that instance features events as they happened in the War of the Ancients trilogy, what actually would make sense as Nozdormu went missing in both and history got altered slightly (even though in the end nozdormu changed a many memories as well...)--Maibe 21:44, 30 March 2007 (EDT)

Actually, you missed my point. The thing is, any retcon that does occur can either be explained away as a butterfly effect of the Infinite Dragonflight's meddling. Or, from an unseen, unplayable encounter where they win. Mr. peasant 06:05, 31 March 2007 (EDT)

You have to be lv 66 to enter any instances, my highest leveled character is only lv 61 so I don't know about it yet, and THANKS FOR THE SPOILER, DAMMIT. Hordesupporter 14:54, 31 March 2007 (EDT)

sign your posts, please. And...seriously...When someone says -Uh, blizzard only put the CoT and Infinite Flight in to retcon things as they desire- no matter how, pardon me, stupid that statement is, you will have to expect spoilers, especially in a case such as this...--Maibe 07:34, 31 March 2007 (EDT)

I was reffering to the fact I didn't know that the bronze flight was rearanging peoples memories. Hordesupporter 14:54, 31 March 2007 (EDT)

Maibe, don't misunderstand me. I didn't say the sole purpose of the introduction of the Infinite Dragonflight is so that Blizzard can retcon things. What I said is that now are able to retcon and still provide a lore reason behind it. Not purpose, but rather side effect. So, I don't think it's fair to call it stupid to mention it especially for those interested in lore coherence. Mr. peasant 15:37, 31 March 2007 (EDT)

I don't really care about spoilers, I just said that to be stupid. Hordesupporter 13:41, 3 April 2007 (EDT)

Speculation: Deathwing

Deathwing does not seem to be strongly involved with the Black Dragonflight anymore, and we know Nefarian was performing experiments to create a new dragonflight, which may stem from his father's desires. Deathwing may turn out to be the "master," and succeeded where his son failed by creating a new dragonflight.

Futhermore, it has been known for some time that there is a cave/portal inside Mount Hyjal identical to Onyxia's, generating speculation that Deathwing may have taken residence there. -- Tyrsenus t c 14:57, 17 April 2007 (EDT)

So, you suggest that Deathwing is working on a new flight, which he sends all across the continent to the caverns, right on the blue flight's lair's roof without them noticing?--Maibe 15:15, 17 April 2007 (EDT)

• Timbermaw Hold connects Felwood, Moonglade, Winterspring, Azshara and Hyjal. Perhaps that cave was intended as a placeholder for Hyjal Timbermaw Hold entrance. The fact that that cave is on a lower level of Hyjal and Hyjal is a lot higher than Timbermaw Hold entrances in other zones it would just make sense. --Drundia 23:19, 6 May 2007 (EDT)

Don't you mean bronze flight? The story has yet to tell us how the inifinite flight got into the timeways, don't just say they used the caverns for that, they may have used some advanced for of magic to directly access the timelines. Hordesupporter 19:35, 18 April 2007 (EDT)

well, I meant the blue flight when talking about roofs. Mazthoril is what I meant.--Maibe 04:25, 19 April 2007 (EDT)

What does Mazthoril have to do with the Caverns of Time? Anyway, as far as how the Infinite Dragonflight got into the timeways, I think we can safely assume that it was NOT via the Caverns of Time, as Andormu says that "they have begun appearing the timeways," strongly implying that they have their own method of entering. Personally, I'm leaning towards a corrupted/alternate history version of the Bronze Dragonflight, given their sand breath, time-related attacks (and everything else), and apparent ability to easily slip into any point in history. - Dark T Zeratul 05:19, 19 April 2007 (EDT)

Well, first to Hordesupporter: For sanity's sake, start using the ':' to make it clear to WHAT you're answering. Second: I was talking about the Blue flight as Tyrsenus talked about Deathwing migth have taken home in/on mt hyjal. what would mean his experiments continue there. And I believe the blue flight would notice it...especially if there are magic-erruptions when the infinite flight uses magic to enter the timestreams...--Maibe 05:43, 19 April 2007 (EDT)

While there are a number of blue dragons at Mazthoril, their actual home (or where Malygos lives, at any rate) is in Northrend. - Dark T Zeratul 05:45, 19 April 2007 (EDT)

The Nexus, Coldarra, I know...yet...still, there are enough blue dragons in mazthoril to notice--Maibe 08:28, 19 April 2007 (EDT)

Well, there's new eveidence that either debunks or reinforces this theory. A black dragon named Lady Sinestra talks to a fel orc in patch 2.1 about how Deathwing is continuing the experiments where his son failed. It's possible that the Infinite Dragonflight were created as part of his experiments, but it could also mean that he's too busy doing other things to bother with this. - Socran 17:05, 25 April 2007 (EDT)

I'd say Neltharion is still working on the Chromatic Dragonflight... He doesn't seem like one to give up on project's he's begun. Which is good, I'd like to see more of the Chromatic flight beyond UBRS/BWL. --Adonzo 05:52, 5 May 2007 (EDT)

It's interesting to note that the black flight is directly or indirectly involved in ALL the alternative flights - the Netherwing are direct descendants of Deathwing, the Plague Dragonflight was created using black dragon eggs, the Chromatic Dragonflight is based on mixing the other flights' genes with the black, and the Undead Dragonflight also has black members. And then we have this Infinite Dragonflight. I wouldn't be surprised in the least if Deathwing was responsible for this flight as well. He's the only leader of the five original flights to be focused on making new flights, and though he's met with limited success so far, the Infinite could be the turning point in his research. He should certainly have a thorn in his side for Nozdormu, who basically thwarted his plans to become ruler of the world by contacting Krasus and Rhonin for help. ----  Varghedin  talk / contribs 06:21, 5 May 2007 (EDT)

Alignment

Is it possible the infinite flight is intrested in the greater good? I notice that one member of the flight, Chrono Lord Deja has a quote that reads "Why do you aid the magus? Just think of how many lives could be saved if the portal is never opened, if the resulting wars could be erased...". Although it's possible, (and more likely) he was just trying to use psychological warfare. Hordesupporter 01:18, 19 April 2007 (EDT)

If the portal never opened, then Burning Legion might have won when it returned to Azeroth. As there wouldn't have been anyone to stop coming forces. Granted the way the returned would have probably been different since there would be no "Scourge".

There might not been anyone to stop the return of the Ahn'Qiraj and Silithid, since there would be no horde, and alliance to join together.

Demon Soul, would never been destroyed, and most of the flights would still be asleep.

There are probably some other evils I'm forgetting about.Baggins 01:28, 19 April 2007 (EDT)

Chrono Lord Deja is basically trying to convince you that the Infinite Dragonflight is doing the right thing by pointing out all the good things that would happen if the Dark Portal was never opened. It seems fairly obvious, though, that this isn't the reason that the Infinite Dragonflight is attempting to kill Medivh, merely a somewhat beneficial side effect. As someone else pointed out earlier, though, there are certainly dire ramifications for this event not taking place: according to Andormu, without the coming of the Horde to unite the human nations into the Alliance, they would instead have descended into Civil War and been utterly unprepared for the eventual invasion of the Burning Legion. - Dark T Zeratul 05:19, 19 April 2007 (EDT)

Of course it also opens up a potential paradox scenario, :p... If medivh was killed, then infinite dragonflight probably would never have existed. Their existence is related to the history of what has happened in the world already, in the current timeline. So if medivh was killed, there would have been no reason for the Infinite Dragonflight to be created (whoever created them), and with no Infinite Dragonflight there wouldn't have been anyone to try to kill Medivh, and so he would have still opened the portal... That kind of paradox could cause utter chaos, or at least the timeline would attempt to repair itself :p... But, eh I wouldn't expect the designers to think of complications and paradoxs in the logic of their storylines, :). In anycase it doesnt matter, since they are stopped before a paradox can take place, :).Baggins 11:09, 19 April 2007 (EDT)

As I said, it's more likly it was psychological warfare, for the most part, only alliance races would be disturbed by the chrono lord's quote, primarly the humans, I wonder how a human on an RP server would react to the comment... Hordesupporter 13:27, 19 April 2007 (EDT)

It would affect the Horde too. If they hadn't come through the portal, the Horde would have collasped into many warring tribes. Thus a civil war. They probably would have ended up destroying themselves with their bloodlust, and there would have been no one to help cure them of their blood curse.Baggins 14:02, 19 April 2007 (EDT)

Ok, fine, Alliance races would probably be MORE affected, you satisfied now? Hordesupporter 14:12, 19 April 2007 (EDT)

Everyone from both sides would have been affected by the Burning Legion, :P... Trolls, and Tauren would have been wiped out, along with all other races of the planet. Uh, blood elves would have probalby never existed, same with Forsaken. There would never have been a "new Horde". So that knocks out most of the horde members.

Back on Draenor orcs would have committed complete genocide of their own kind, all the ogres would have probably been destroyed as well. All draenei probably have been wiped out. When the burning legion finally decided to attack their planet, there would be very little opposition, and they would have wiped out or assimilated everything as well.

So ya all races of both sides would have been equally affected.Baggins 14:16, 19 April 2007 (EDT)

As I said... most likly phycological warfare. Hordesupporter 16:00, 2 May 2007 (EDT)

Aeonus refers to the players as "beings of the past" meaning, he is from the future, not the past. He has come from further in the future than we have if we are "of the past." Perhaps to prevent/cause some future catastrophy. Fenrirdewolf 18:59, 22 December 2007 (MDT)

Another theory about creation

After the events on the mount Hyjal several problems have arised in the world. Several triumphs of the Lich King, Illidan went all evil, War of the Qiraji, and some more events that didn't happen yet (probably something terrible that have erased all mortal races so they couldn't even get help from brave adventurers as Bronze Dragons of the present do in COT). The Bronze Dragons of the future have come to a conclusion that this crisis is a direct result of Archimonde corruption the World Tree, Nordrassil. He came too close, the mortal races couldn't hold him for long enough and Malfurion's trap didn't work in time. They have decided to go to the past, to the Battle of Mount Hyjal and prevent Archimonde from coming to the World Tree at all cost. However, they have failed. Either they became too desperate or were corrupted by these very events, but their scales got darkened. Maybe even the future events erased all other Dragonflights as well which would be a good reason why they called themselves Infinite.

They figured that a more powerful force is required to stop Archimonde. Cenarius. Yes, Demigod could be a valuable ally against Archimonde if only not for blasted Orcs that have killed him. Oh yes, if Thrall would have never escaped Durnholde, or perhaps escaped later, Cenarius would be alive! And they went in attempt to prevent Thrall's escape. However their efforts were sabotaged by Bronze Dragons of present with some help from brave adventurers.

They decided to take an even more serious step. If the portal would have never be open, there would be no Lich King here, there would be noone to summon Archimonde, noone to kill Cenarius. Yet again, their efforts were sabotaged.

And now when two attempts of Infinite Dragonflight to alter timeline were prevented, it was either Infinite Dragons that contacted Bronze Dragons of the present to explain that they must get aid to stop Archimonde's ascent at all cost, or these Bronze Dragons simply assumed that Infinite Dragonflight would be likely to alter this timeline as well, yet they didn't because no bosses of the Battle of Mount Hyjal seem to have anything to do with Infinite Dragonflight (at least none of the currently known).

Drundia 21:23, 3 May 2007 (EDT)

I posted a while ago that I speculated that maybe Nozdormu himself is responceable for the infinite dragonflight for some reason, possiby to change his unavoidable death that the titans showed him somehow. It fits: one leader, dragonkin loyal, power over time, and he IS missing... The User:Magnusjohanlsn/Beetalbare, The Corrupted Shard of Aman'Thul's Rod rumor, though old, may not be far off.--SWM2448 21:28, 3 May 2007 (EDT)

All right, let's see.

1) Sandwichman, It is a complete 180 shift in Nozdormu's character to avoid his death. Even if the Old Gods could pull the same trick as they did with Neltharion (which they can no longer rely on), it would take much longer.

2) Given what we've seen of dragons, it's highly unlikely that this is the method they'd choose, unless all of the Aspects had been destroyed.

3) Since Cenarius was almost killed by Archimonde, with only a small amount of effort, it doesn't make sense that they'd regard him as the solution. Also, it was Hellscream, not Thrall, who was the problem. It would suit their purposes far better to eliminate Hellscream and allow Thrall to make first contact with the night elves.

--Ragestorm (talk · contr) 23:28, 3 May 2007 (EDT)

• Perhaps Aspects were destroyed in that evil future
• And as for Cenarius, he could still be a valuable ally, maybe more valuable than all those Orcs, Trolls, Tauren, Humans, High Elves, Dwarfs and Gnomes as it required Orcs to drink Mannoroth's blood again to kill Cenarius. Thrall rallied the new Horde and as for Night Elves I don't think it would help as Night Elves remained hostile to "outlanders" until Medivh told them everything. But I guess we can blame Medivh for not appearing earlier and not making peace between all those races.
• Drundia 23:07, 6 May 2007 (EDT)

Also: to say that all the evils of the world are a direct result of the death of Nordrassil is simply ridiculous, and a conclusion that the Bronze Dragonflight would NEVER reach on their own. The existence of Nordrassil really only had two effects: the immortality of the night elves and the protection of the Well of Eternity. The War of the Shifting Sands, Illidan's defeat at the hands of Arthas, and the victories of the Scourge in Lordaeron would have happened regardless of whether or not Nordrassil was alive or not. Yes, stopping Thrall's escape would have prevented Cenarius's death at Hellscream's hands. And yes, stopping the Dark Portal from opening would have resulted in the Scourge never being formed. But the Bronze Dragonflight is not this short-sighted, and they know very well the more dire consequences (and even inform the players of these). If Thrall never formed the new Horde, they never would have been present to stop the Legion's advance up Mt. Hyjal. If the Dark Portal had never been opened, the Alliance would never have been formed and the Legion would have smashed the world when another opportunity arose for them to invade. Yes, it's possible (and indeed quite likely) that the Infinite Dragonflight is a corrupted form the Bronze Dragonflight, but their goal seems to be the victory of the Legion rather than something as petty as saving Nordrassil. - Dark T Zeratul 22:48, 6 May 2007 (EDT)

• It is unknown what events they tried to stop earlier, but one incomplete instance in COT seems to refer to some night elf ship. Maybe very early times. Perhaps Highborne departure to Eastern Kingdoms. It was after all Elves that teached Humans all magic. The Legion would have never returned if Highborne would never be able to form Quel'Thalas and teach Humans to use magic (as is assumed by some individuals in other sections here).
• As for what would happen if that or that, we may never know. If Burning Legion attacked unprepared Eastern Kingdoms, Alliance would form and perhaps High Elves could try to inform Night Elves that their darkest enemy has returned. Once again it's unknown whether Scourge weakening forces in Lordaeron and Quel'Thalas or a possible civil war would be worse. But then again, civil war to wipe out Humans? Perhaps that's why we exist and discuss Infinite Dragonflight from all over the world.
• Drundia 23:07, 6 May 2007 (EDT)

Actually, one of the bronze dragons specifically tells you that if the Alliance had not been formed by the invasion of the Horde, the nations would instead have fallen into civil war and ultimately been eradicated by the Burning Legion, resulting in a very decisive Legion victory. As for Cenarius, he was very nearly killed last time he fought Archimonde, and back then he was backed by all the other demi-gods (the ones who DIDN'T survive). He isn't omnipotent, and it's ridiculous to assume that he would be more valuable than the combined might of the all the armies that gathered on the slopes of Mt. Hyjal to push back the demons' advance. - Dark T Zeratul 09:06, 7 May 2007 (EDT)

• A possibility of civil war is of course possibility, however a lot of destruction around Alliance lands was caused by either Orcs or Scourge. Gilneas didn't join Alliance, Alterac betrayed Alliance during the Second War, Azeroth suffered utter defeat in the First War. All of the Lordaeron nations were wiped by either Scourge or Burning Legion anyway. While there possibly were nearly all Orcs, Trolls and Taurens, as for Humans it was only Jaina's expedition. Don't forget casualties new Horde, Jaina's expedition and Night Elves caused to each other and of course Legion being backed by the Scourge. I mean did they actually try out that future if Thrall would have never escaped or if portal would have never be opened? One certain thing is that world would be very different from what it is now. It is also unknown who and when would summon Burning Legion. --Drundia 10:02, 8 May 2007 (EDT)

When the Caverns of Time were first announced with the expansion, there was supposed to be a fourth instance, a battleground, based on the Battle of Hellfire Peninsula. This got scraped, but I do believe that is what the fourth portal is. The wrecked elven ship would represent the elven destroyers that the alliance employed in naval battles during the Second War. --Adonzo 04:35, 7 May 2007 (EDT)

• If we trust Caverns_of_Time#Unfinished_Content (I'll need to check that dialogue myself) they discuss Kaldorei (Night Elf) ship, not Quel'dorei (High Elf) so it probably has nothing to do with Second War. The portal there is currently purple (dual-difficulty 5-man) so it's more like future instance, than abandoned battlegrounds project. --Drundia 10:02, 8 May 2007 (EDT)

The 6th flight?

I'd just like to throw some speculation in to the mix here. While i was re-reading the novel Day of the Dragon, i noticed that when Krasus attemped to contact Nozdormu he used a special flower, the Eon Rose. The flower, had five petals, each a different colour. I quote from the book: 'Five petals of astonishing different hues surrounding a golden sphere in the centre. Fiery red. Emerald green. Snowy Silver. Deep-sea blue. Midnight Black. Each petal radiated with beauty that artists could only dream of.' Clearly the colours represent each of the flights - except one.

When i first read it, i thought of silver as the Blue flights colour - Malygos had been described in the book as a 'silvery-blue', but looking back i ask why would the blue flight have 2 of these petals dedicated to it? But silver isn't the colour of the infinite flight? At a glance perhaps, but throughout the Onyx appearence run streams of silver. They are after-all, considered metalic in looks, and silver can be very, very dull before it is considered truely black. Perhaps they were once fully silver, and have been corrupted? I don't know, but its some food for thought. --Falconon 19:35, 14 May 2007 (EDT)

Jesus. I've been reading through all of these hardly ledgible theories as to the origins of this Infinite dragonflight, insanely curious myself, and THIS one is the only one that made me nod my head in agreeance. This is an excellent judgement. I wondered that myself about the flower while reading the book. I mean, it doesn't exactly explain their origins, but I can only assume they were created by the Titans along with the other lot. I try to look at all Warcraft lore as being known and explained by someone -in- Warcraft... not Metzen. So if their books have no record of the Infinite flight for whatever reason, perhaps that is why we know nothing about them. But there's still the possibility of other things. If Deathwing is truly still working on a chromatic flight, which originally consisted of red and black being mixed together because as far as I know he didn't go gather eggs from everyone else... the entire plot of Day of the Dragon was centered around him getting Alexstrasza's eggs and then being defeated when Rhonin destroyed the Demon Soul... perhaps he's now in possession of some blue eggs, and this is the result of mixing black with blue? If you recall in War of the Ancients trilogy Krasus put some of Malygos' eggs in stasis to allow his flight to prosper in the future. So far there's not been much prospering that we know of... as Mazorthil is full of dragonkin, which are not the same as actual dragons. Everyone knows Malygos lives on Northrend, but so does Arthas... so I imagine it's a little difficult to not be turned into a draco-lich when you're right under the Lich King's nose (not that Malygos has, but his offspring may be). So if the flight has not prospered, maybe Malygos has not gotten the eggs yet. We don't really know what's going on with Krasus and the reds, the greens are going nuts from the Emerald Nightmare, the blacks are their usual selves, and the bronzes are as well. So if Deathwing found those eggs... it makes a bit of sense. So far Blizzard has done little to show how the events in War of the Ancients may have affected the future. Like Night Elves being a little more accepting of orcs because of Tyrande's relationship with Brox, as well as Malfurion's. Or Malygos' flight prospering. Having Deathwing in possession of those eggs would show that they finally decided to acknowledge the novel, as well as explain Epoch Hunter's referral to a single master.

I donno, it's all just speculation of course... but I think it makes a lot of sense if Deathwing created the Infinite flight. But they still could have been around since the beginning, based on that blue or silver petal on the Eon Rose. Lilyth 20:24, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

If you look at this screen shot from wrath of the lich king you can see white drakes with blue metal plates on there back flying in there are perhaps it is them that the color represented. Also note the black dragon whelp in the bottom right corner of the picture that i just noticed its hard to see unless you magnify the picture. [[1]]------Vrell 23:15, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

Not actually dragons?

Is it possible that the infinite dragon flight might not actually be dragons? It's possible that they merely look like dragons, what with their shadowy forms and deteriorating outline. Just something I had been thinking about.

Aeonus in The Opening of the Dark Portal instance says: "The time has come to shatter this clockwork universe forever! Let us no longer be slaves of the hourglass! I warn you: those who do not embrace the greater path shall become victims of its passing!" When he spawns. Now this to me seems that the flight has some vendetta against the bronze and the order they keep with the time lines. It could be they are like the Burning Legion and simply want chaos.--Karye May 24, 2007

Speculation: Deathwing

The talk about the infinite dragonflight being deathwings creations seam very likely to me as Lady Sinestra, a black dragon in shadowmoon valley trades netherdrake mounts for netherdrake eggs with the fel orcs there. So perhaps the infinite dragonflight is a mix between netherdrakes and black dragons. Or the netherdrake eggs have had blood from either the black flight or captured bronze dragons injected. Elrox 12:25, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

netherdrakes are black drakes altered by netherenergies, so...speaking frankly, netherdrake + black drake is more likely a simple black drake--Maibe 16:42, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

I was thinking along these lines, but somewhat different. You mention Lady Sinestra, but remember the rest of the conversation. She first talks about Nefarian's death and the failure of his project to revive the Chromatic Dragonflight, and says that Deathwing still continues the experiments. Only then does she ask for the Netherwing eggs. It sounds like Deathwing wants the eggs in connection with his newest version of Chromatic dragon. Also in that conversation, she calls Deathwing "The Master," just as the Infinite Dragonflight refers to some unknown "Master."

Now, my idea is that the Infinite Dragonflight is Deathwing's new and improved Chromatic flight, this time crossed with Netherwing dragons. Possibly this is meant to breed out the occasional dire weaknesses in individual Chromatics, or to introduce some new magical power unique to Netherwing. They also have an improved mastery of time from the Bronze aspect. Improved, but not entirely new: Chromaggus could stop time, though not travel through time as the Infinite and Bronze flights do. --Hevach 20:29, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

An abberation of the netherwing perhaps?

My understanding of the lore in the warcraft novels is hazy, so this theory is probably easy to discredit, but here goes. MY theory on the infinite flight.

Infinite dragonflight: The best way to identify the origins of a nemesis is to look at the forces they are at war with and whom this faction holds as existing enemies. The faction of course here being the bronze dragonflight, caretakers of the caverns of time and of history itself.

So far the only time that the bronze flight has made its presence known/felt was so that it could combat the ancient forces of the Old gods. So its a fair guess that the Old gods are in someway responsible for the actions of the infinite flight. They have tried to assault the caverns of time in the past during the war of the shifting sands. An act that was likely the source of thier undoing, atleast to the denizens of Ahn qiraj. Subsequently the Bronze flight lent their aid to the Night elf forces during the war and we're critical in sealing the Qiraji behind the scarab wall, stemming the tide of qiraji forces and ending the war abruptly. They were also responsible for rallying the mortal races of modern times to unite and confront the Old god C'thun in 'its' temple city before it could regenerate its full power. Considering that all the Pre-BC raid dungeons are now somewhat redundant, it would be fair to say that the forces of ahn qiraj have been defeated by the combined might of the alliance and the horde (Debatable and unconfirmed until proven otherwise by blizzard).

Of course none of this explains why a new dragonflight has popped up to wreak havoc in the Caverns of time today. However i believe the sudden emergence of this flight can be attributed to the opening of the dark portal. So far there have been only 2 real references to the old gods in in outland. One reference is from a questline in shadowmoon valley which sees the Arrakoa attempting to summon a horrid fiend into the world of draenor. This being uses the same model as C'thun and is depicted by Parshah (the associated quest giver) as an ancient and powerful evil. The second reference is located in the Arcatraz in the form of the final boss Harbinger Skyriss. A'dal of shattrath directly identifies Skyriss as a Qiraji and a servant of the old gods. Skyriss also gives subtle hints, stating that they are untouched by time and infinite in number.

Still the link between the old gods and the infinite flight is not Apparent in the WOW universe. Thus we have to take a look back into the past history of the warcraft universe and more importantly at the 1st flight to be influenced by the old gods. The black dragonflight. Neltharion (now Deathwing) was slowly but surely corrupted by the Old gods until he became a maddened shadow of his former self. This act alone sealed the fate of the entire blackflight. This is the 1st major link between the Old gods and the dragonflights in general, but this is not the most likely source of the infinite flight. If it was the source they would have made their presence known before the opening of the dark portal (perhaps the bronze dragonflight has been dealing with the infinite flight for longer than we know but simply chose to keep it secret till now). More likely the origins of the infinite flight are tied to the Netherwing flight.

The netherwing flight we're Originally black dragon eggs. but the destruction of draenor bombarded them with enormous amounts of nether energies, warping and forever changing them to the semi-corporeal form we see ingame today. The fact the Old gods corrupted the blackflight in the past gives them an intrinsic link to the blackflight and all its offspring, but the fact Deathwing hid the netherwing progeny away on draenor before the collapse of the dark portal may have hidden them from the Old gods sight(Or distanced them enough to be un affected by thier will). The re-opening of the portal however may have given the Old gods a new link to Outland, at which point they sensed the presence of the newly formed netherwing flight. Perhaps they saw this flight as 'putty to mould' in a sense. The strange void/nether like state in conjunction with thier corrupted blackflight heritage would have made them the perfect subjects to manipulate and mould into loyal minions. The netherwing have already indicated they are seeking an existence beyond the workings of thier maker Deathwing. The fact the Old gods influence has already reached Outland makes it entirely feasible that the Old gods called out to the lost and unguided netherwing flight, likely with promises of power or knowledge or an existence where they would enforce the will of the Old gods across not just azeroth and draenor, but all worlds. Wether or not all of the netherwing flight or just a portion of them answered the summons of the Old gods is unknown. but it would certainly make sense that the infinite flight are an abberation of the netherwing, born of the Old gods power.

Although now im left to wonder if a Flight can exist without its Aspect to lord over it. And considering other theories posted it wouldn't be suprising to find out that Deathwing had a hand in the creation of the infinite flight. Perhaps he has struck some bargain with the Old gods in order to evade the wrath of the remaining flights. Assuming they havn't already caught up with him and imprisoned him. It is possible he is being held in grim batol by Alexstrazsa and her kin, and any pact he has with the old gods/infinite flight is an attempt to obtain freedom. Exaclty how they would be able to imprison an entity as powerful as Deathwing is a mystery. Though I understand they are loathed to actually kill deathwing as the repercussions would be really REALLY bad to say the least.

A little theory based on the 'Eon rose' post above. After Deathwings' corruption and the creation of the demon soul, his skin broke apart and he subsequently had large adamantite plates (Distinctly snowy silver in appearance) attached to his skin to contain the power inside him. The silver petal on the rose may represent the corrupted side of Neltharions' spirit. The Eon rose is bound more to the Aspects of the flights as apposed to the flights themselves. Perhaps the rose originally had only 4 petals and the 5th appeared to represent the corruption evident in the black flight, or perhaps as a reaction to the creation of the demon soul. If this petal is bound to the infinite flight then they have been around for atleast as long as the Neltharion 'after' he created the demon soul. Simply put, the black petal represents Neltharion and the silver petal may represent Deathwing. Something of a metaphor but this would mean that Neltharion on some level still retains the persona he had before he became Deathwing.

This is all of course speculation. Ive had the idea running around in my head for sometime, its only recently i decided to commit it text. Make of it what you will. I hope this has been at least somewhat insightful for some. Thanks for taking the time to read the ramblings of undead warrior with too much time on his hands :) feel free to poke holes in this theory or edit it as the admins see fit.

Theory devised by Thraks of Khaz'goroth. Lore and and history obtained from Wowwiki .you guys at wowwiki are legends. Wowwiki is my bible. keep up the good work. by the way, this is my 1st post on wowwiki ever. dont eat me please.(edited twice for typos and to cut out some irrelevant crap) Thraks66 12:06, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

The Secret Master of the Flight

Really, only one phrase uttered in the game gives any credence at all to this, but when you think about it, it makes perfect sense. The phrase to which I refer is when one of the bosses in Black Morass says that they will put an end to this "clockwork universe". Now who else has exhibited an aversion to universe being clockwork? Who else has said that he would like Time to be as it is in Kharazan, to be an hourglass of sorts? Medivh himself. It is entirely possible that far back, when Medivh was possessed by Sargeras, his hatred of the "clockwork universe" led him to create the infinite dragonflight, and perhaps send them forward through time to... now. Which would put the Burning Legion firmly in the stead of secret masters of the infinite flight. A little far-fetched perhaps, but all possibilites must be considered. ~ Peregrine

So you actually mean Sargeras, not Medivh? Kirkburn talk contr 14:14, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

Well, thats a question for discussion... While Sargeras possessed Medivh, we don't know if Medivh was utterly dominated by him, or if part of Sargeras lived in part of Medivh, or if it was just Sargeras' will that turned Medivh evil and that's all... its a point for consideration, however. ~ Peregrine

Theory of the Infinite Dragonflight's Creation

Does that belong there? It is, after all, complete speculation with just about absolutely no evidence of any kind to suggest it... there are plenty of facts and theories to back it up, but there is no evidence to suggest it in the first place. I mean hell, if that belongs on there, so does my extremely unlikely Medivh theory :) Just thought I'd bring it to the attention of whomever keeps watch over here.~ Peregrine

It doesn't even cover all the theories. I say remove.--SWM2448 00:25, 17 July 2007 (UTC)

Unless I get a positive (or negative, I suppose the word would be) no from an admin, I'm just gonna go ahead and delete that... ~ Peregrine

I've renamed it to Speculation of origin, feel free to delete. I really don't think it belongs. Raze 05:33, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

Okay then, havent recieved a "WAIT STOP YOU MORON" from an admin so ima just go ahead and delete it... ~ Peregrine

Mt.Hyjal and Dark Portal

I've looked this page, and people keep mentioning that if Medivh hadn't opened the Portal and released the orcs, there would be no New Horde to help stop the Burning Legion. Now that we see that there were no Infinites in Hyjal, we only assume they made some unseen change. My point is, what if they had plans to help stop the Legion themselves, and we messed it up by letting the Horde out, then since the Bronze's help, us, showed up in Hyjal, they backed off. Just a theory, don't know if its been mentioned Felhunger 18:57, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Could I have a map to that theory, please? Sorry, I'd comment but I really have no idea what in the seven circles of hell you're saying. ~Peregrine Faithbearer 19:19, 27 September 2007 (UTC)

Could the master be Sargeras or Kiljaeden?

It could be speculation that this dark flight is under either creation or serves the Burning Legion's master Sargeras or Kiljaeden. As by Epoch Hunter says after his death "The master... will... not be pleased..." And with Kil'jaeden's first failures of Illidan. Another thing probably is they help kill Thrall which if they do then the Horde would still be as it is the Old Horde, they also do not appear in the instance with the Battle of Mount Hyjal because they would interfere Archimonde.

Also Kil'jaeden and Sargeras have had references as "The Master..." by Kael'thas and Gul'dan. --Melean 20:47, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

Could the master be the (dead?) C'thun or maybe a person over any suspicion?

There are some hints towards this speculation.

Motive to send a dragon-flight through time to prevent the scourge from ever appearing:

 The alliance and the horde would never be forged and when C'thun's legions would break
 out into the world they would practically face far lesser resistance.

Facts and hints that could support C'thun's experiments with time:

• The rise of the Scarab Wall left some dragons trapped within the walls. They were also binded there by a spell of C'thun. What if C'thun did more than just holding them binded. What if he used them throughout the thousands years they were trapped in the ruins, to produce new hybrids of dragons for his own purposes?

• C'thun's legions dug tunnels spanning over four nearby regions. One of them was Tanaris. Uldum resides in tanaris. A complex built by the Titans near the Caverns of Time. Moreover we have silithid spawns swarming out of titan-like ruins at the shimmering flats (near the borders of tanaris). Now, it wouldn't be hard to imagine that the silithid run into the underground complex of Uldum under Tanaris. If they did and given the artifacts and structures that the Titans could have stored in Uldum it could be possible that C'thun used whatever power layed dormnant in Uldum for his own purproses - maybe powers allowing him to send specific creatures back through time.

Finally there is one more disturbing thing:

The Infinite Dragonflight's nightmare-like looks could also be attributed to them being under the effects of a powerful curse. Now there is another series of events that is tightly related to producing powerful curses and that series of events involves silithus, the cenarion circle and finally a figure high-up in the `food-chain': Fandral Staghelm. The connective link between all these is called `Morrowgrain'. One can understand that `Morrowgrain' has something to do with the activities of the Cenarion Circle in Silithus by the fact that you are assigned with the task to clean up the resupply-lines of the Cenarion Hold in silithus because a cargo of `Morrowgrain' was stolen on it's way to the hold. But think about it: Who in his right mind would ever send a cargo as valuable as that with so low security measures that it could be stolen just outside the hold? If you connect the dots there is something heavily out of place with the way Staghelm carries out his `research'. Only someone inside the Cenarion Circle could have provided the information necessary for the route and the schedule of the cargo along with the lack of proper security provisions to make the loss of the cargo possible. And to which hands could Morrowgrain end up to, except for the silithid and/or C'thun's shadow-council faithful minions?

All in all mix: C'thun, tunnels connecting the ruins of Ahn'Qiraj with Uldum and it's artifacts, the trapped dragons behind the Scarab Wall, Staghelm's mysterious dealings with Morrowgrain and you have a capable picture coming forth. --Senoinus 19:02, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

It fits the facts, I'll grant you that. But then so do a dozen or so other explanations. ~Peregrine Faithbearer 19:18, 27 September 2007 (UTC)

At some point they're not that evil?

Well I was reading the quotes from the Dragon Overlord when you defend Medivh in opening the Dark Portal, but his quotes seem good and not on the evil side:

"Spawn

• Why do you aid the Magus? Just think of how many lives could be saved if the portal is never opened, if the resulting wars could be erased ...

Aggro

• If you will not cease this foolish quest, then you will die!

Player Kill

• I told you it was a fool's quest!

Death

• Time ... is on our side."

I think there not doin a total evil deed, but true they are messing with time but what they do is sorta good, they can help save lives from teh ruthless onslaught of the orcs.

--Melean 00:07, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

You fell for that? It is good in the short term but would be disasterous in the long.--SWM2448 00:12, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

Hey now, don't be so quick to assume they have total catastrophe on their agenda... So far Blizzard has proven to be extraordinarily black-and-white with their villains, as in either you're good or you're total evil. The only villains I've noted with any grey area are Illidan (yes, he is evil, but not the "muahahahaha you're all going to die" evil, more of a "I frickin hate my goddam life cuz my chick loves my brother and every living creature hates me" evil) and, to a lesser extent, Arthas. All the other characters are either pure, holy, good guys or sinister, evil bad guys. The Infinite Dragonflight could simply be doing what they believe they must do in order to save Azeroth... that would raise stupidity to an art form, but always try to refrain from thinking in terms of "pure and good" and "totally evil", nothing else. Greay area does exist. ~Peregrine Faithbearer 01:05, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

Archimonde

I always assumed that it was Archimonde that was the leader of the Infinite dragonflight since he is the last boss of Mt Hyjal. I don't know exactly how he managed to create a dragonflight to do it or when but it makes sense... sort of. He sends his dragons to stop Thrall from escaping from Durnholde and therefore to stop the creation of the New Horde; a force which was instrumental in his defeat, and he also sends the infinites to stop Medivh from opening the Dark Portal for the same reason. Now that I look at it, the theory has a lot of holes in it but I never even thought about there being an alternative until today.

--Taureg 18:09, 02 October 2007 (GMT)

Archimonde, I think, would have absolutely no power over dragons. The creation of new beings is nigh impossible for anybody except great powers like the Titans or the Old Gods - beings can be subverted, changed, combined, etc, but not created. Yes, Archimonde could have "changed" black/bronze dragons (most likely bronze if this were true) but I find it hard to believe that any dragon, no matter how deluded or corrupted, would side with Archimonde. Hell, even Deathwing hated the Burning Legion - though I suppose more as rivals than anything else. ~Peregrine - Master Chief FTW! 21:52, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

Salandria

In the Orphan's week, the orphan you take under your care in the Horde side was a female blood elf named Salandria. When you visit Caverns of time with the child, two dragonkin guardians came to attack her at once, but Zaladormu (the big bronze dragon with ethereal appereance in the middle of the square) stopped them at once saying that the child did nothing YET, and she wasn't responsible of whatever se'll do in the future. Even more, when you gave the dragon toy to her she said that one day she will own one. Because of that I'm convinced that she is the true mastermind of the infinite dragonflight, but her motivations remains unknown. It seems that infinite dragonflight doesnt appear in the battle for mount Hyjal at all, so they could be not chained with the another two instances. ~Linoge 14:04, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Very, very, interesting, Linoge... That puts a whole new perspective on theories. Because you know, it seems that the Bronze Dragonlfight's favorite form to assume is that of a Blood Elf... ~Peregrine - Master Chief FTW! 16:03, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Zal says the same thing for the draenei girl, but not the owning part. Odd.--SWM2448 20:02, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

The draenei kid said that she wanted to be a friend of a dragon one day. It's possible that she will make friendship with another dragonflight opposite to the Bronze dragonflght. Is possible that a draenei and a blood elf will cooperate in a future? I don't know, but they are both orphans and they could hate the orcs for different reasons (the attacks of the infinites are focused against the orcs)perhaps for something that will happen in the future? we shall know eventually. Linoge 20:40, 31 October 2007 (GMT)

The attacks aren't really focused on the orcs, just important individuals, one of which happens to be an orc, the other of which is the person who summoned the orcs into Azeroth.

Obviously the infinite dragonflight see the orcs as more of a threat than the humans :S I feel insulted! ~Don't say Retnoob, say Peregrine 13:43, 17 November 2007 (UTC)

I think you're jumping to conclusions here. They attacked out of slight paranoia, not cause the child, draenei or bloodelf, will be the master of the infinite flight. IF they'd know that THAT would be the point, they'd likely and dearly mess up the timeline by killing the child.--Maibe 18:35, 29 December 2007 (UTC)

I think that even if this child WILL become the master of the flight, they wouldn't kill it. Nozdormu would be sorely pised off if they went and altered the timeline. ~My rage bar is blue and I start the fight pissed - Peregrine 15:16, 30 December 2007 (UTC)

Add to that the fact that the WotLK Caverns of time instance is the culling of Stratholme. No Culling, No Death Knighted Arthas, no High Elves having their head's handed to them by their undead bodies. I can't think of a good reason why she'd interfere with Thrall's escape (has nothing to do with Bloods or the Scourge invasion) but no orcs in the first place might help preserve part of the family killed in the second war. The Battle for Mount Hyjal could be an opportunity to save another part of the family killed there. On another note I doubt Dornaa would cooperate with Salandria. Correct me if I'm wrong, but they honor the Draenei kid as opposed to attack, so she probably works with the Bronze's to fight Sally. Meneldir 03:47, 7 February 2008 (UTC)

You, dear...missed out a good bunch of lore. First: If Medivh/Sargeras wouldn't have managed to summon the orcs in the first place, the legion would have found another way to get them to Azeropth and do their dirty work. Perhabs even the Highelves. Second: Bloodelves give, as Highelves already gave, a fudge about the nightelves. and last but not least (if not most important) The dragon says the very same things about the draenei girl. So...are you going to tell me they'll work together?--Maibe 13:04, 7 February 2008 (UTC)

Ok, I'll give you that I was wrong about the Bronze's reaction to Dornaa. Your other two points are either false or irrelevant. 1st of all,If you listen to the Infinite's during the CoT instance at the Dark Portal, they clearly state that their objective is to avert countless wars, thus we can tell they don't want the orcs in Azeroth. Furthermore the High's would never bring the orcs or the Demons to Azeroth. The Sunwell and the Runestones both worked to keep the Demons from noticing the Elves, and furthermore, they were among the founders of the Order of Tirisfal, thus they have vested interest in keeping both Demon's and they're minions away. 2nd: The conflict between the Bloods and the Nights would not make anyone want to change Hyjal's outcome, and if you notice, the infinites aren't fighting alongside the legion, so whatever their influence (if any) it is not to change the outcome (which would only destroy the High/Blood Elves more, and destroy herself/ancestors). Now that's what I think your point is, as I can't see any other sort of relevant point coming from your statement there. Now as for the Bronzes starting to attack and the timestream, I could see a completely loyal bronze or 2 thinking that killing the interloper in time before they get there is part of their duty. Then a wiser Bronze stops them. That's my interpretation. It's all speculation though. Meneldir 16:27, 7 February 2008 (UTC)

"Furthermore the High's would never bring the orcs or the Demons to Azeroth."

Umm.... they already did. Read War of the Ancients. If they could be corrupted into doing it before, they can again. Just look at Kael'Thas. ~My rage bar is blue and I start the fight pissed - Peregrine 20:08, 7 February 2008 (UTC)

"Sigh." The High Elves of the time of the 1st two wars were very unlike the highborne that that served Sargeras and the Queen. I have read War of the Ancients and it shows that the High Elves are descended from the Highborne who saw the madness around them and left, abandoning Azshara, and even working against the legion while they were there, so don't pull that card. That, and you forgot what I mentioned about the Tirsfal Guardians and the Runestones and Sunwell. How is the Legion going to corrupt a group who are effectively shielded from them? It took an unsuccessful Orc invasion to isolate them so that a successful scourge inavasion could drive them to the madness where they are now. It wouldn't have been the Highs. Meneldir 23:34, 7 February 2008 (UTC)

You know, if your theory would stand on solid ground, you wouldn't need to move and twist the facts until they suit your theory each and every time. The -she's not responsible for stuff- thing was a general addressing, the children could just as well become death knights or what else, it doesn't necessarily mean one of them is going to lead the Infinite Flight. As said, the guards are just trying to attack as the think she might harm the dragon.--Maibe 01:11, 8 February 2008 (UTC)

Um, where am I twisting facts? I'm just drawing conclusions based off the facts given, and I'm fully aware that it's all speculation anyway. Btw, how do you know what it is. Blizzard tell you? We're all speculating here. The fact is, there is evidence that shouldn't be ignored, and I'm bringing it up. Meneldir 02:57, 8 February 2008 (UTC)

"Just think of how things would be if the portal were never opened. If the resulting wars could be erased." This is not clearly stating their objectives. Clearly stating their objectives would be, "Hey, idiots, we're trying to save you guys from the orcs here!" No, what Chrono Lord Deja is doing is trying to convince you that what they're doing is right. He's saying, "Hey, come on, look at all the GOOD stuff that'll happen if we win! See? Isn't that good?" What they're clearly NOT stating, however, are the downsides of such a major historical change, namely that it would lead to a Legion victory. As far as it not being possible for the high elves to bring the Legion to Azeroth, well, I've got one word for you: Kael'thas. -- Dark T Zeratul 06:24, 8 February 2008 (UTC)

First: sorry for writing here, the discussion goes a bit too far towards the side... But, menel, have you ever considered the following (as you like theories that much): Let's assume what you think is right, and the elven girl is the head of the flight and does everything just to save her people and maybe even the nightelves. Okay...but...if the flight kills medivh at the portal, sargeras might escape and/or perhabs he or one of the other legion-leaders will use a 'devise' sent to azeroth much later in the original timeline: Perhabs they'd blame Guldan and do the same to him kil'jaeden would have done to Ner'zhul: Make him lichking and send him to the world that way. Now let's see: That would open the point that likely the nerubians would open the gate...and not only would they open it, no, they'd also have the scourge. That means that doubles the might. and...they'd come from Northrend...What then means they can attack Lordaeron and Quel'thalas and northern Kalimdor likewise. What then again means: The unprepared High- and Nightelves would be among the first victims.--Maibe 15:03, 8 February 2008 (UTC)

1st, DTZ, you raise a good point with the the quote. You are probably right there. However, going to the High Elves, all you did was reiterate Peregrin's comment, which I've already answered, and you managed to completely ingore what I have said, so I'll repeat it. The High Elves were shielded from Legion Attention by the Runestones (and if you read ToD, their magics didn't even work in Quel'Thalas at the time). That and Kael wasn't insane until after a Scourge Invasion killed his Father and destroyed his homeland, a bigoted human tried to feed him to the Scourge and then ordered him executed for getting what help he could to win anyway, and then the wonderful influence of Illidan. You can't compare the Bloods now the the High's then.

Now to you Maibe. Don't worry about moving it, that's fine. Your theory works well enough, but I'll point out this. Killing Medivh wouldn't have released Sargeras. You know why? It's been done (Khadgar and Lothar pulled it off), and Sargeras isn't free. Other than that, your theory as to what might have happened is fine. All of this is speculation though, so both our theories there have equal chance of being right or wrong. It's a possibillity, but a possibillity only. Meneldir 16:50, 8 February 2008 (UTC)

I'm not saying that Kael'thas would have summoned Kil'jaeden anyway. I'm saying that you shouldn't categorically say it's impossible for the high elves to have done so. In any event, had Medivh not summoned they Legion, they would eventually have gotten to Azeroth eventually anyway (and with more disastrous results). Andormu says as much, and as he's a bronze dragon I think he's in a position to know. -- Dark T Zeratul 20:18, 8 February 2008 (UTC)

Since Ragestorm hasn't been on lately, I feel obliged to yell "NOT A FORUM". ~My rage bar is blue and I start the fight pissed - Peregrine 21:50, 8 February 2008 (UTC)

Good point Peregrine, should we make a speculation page or a analysis page for this, as this page seems to be full of both? Meneldir 15:30, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

About six months has passed since I made this theory. With the release of the 2.4 patch and the new events things looks different. The two kids fit better into the Shattered Sun offensive plot, and perhaps they are responsible of the death of Kalec (or another dragon) what would explain the dragonkin guards behaviour.~Linoge 21:34, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

Kalecgos isn't killed, he is "freed from his demonic taint" and whatnot. ~My rage bar is blue and I start the fight pissed - Peregrine 03:42, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

ALLIANCE WITH THE BLACK DRAGONFLIGHT?

There is a chance they can be on the Black Dragonflights side,they seem like they want the same thing. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Ksergey (talk · contr).

Another Flight

My idea about the infinite Dragonflight is that they might be a totally different flight from the five we already know. It is stated somewhere in the lore (I forgot where) that there is more the five flights. The Infinite could be one of these. Why they attack the timeways, that, I don't know. I like the "Flight from the future" Idea though. FireFangs 15:01, 15 January 2008 (UTC)

I agree. The Infinte are a totally different flight...but if you know what aeonus says in the caverns of time "The time has come, to shatter this clockwork universe forever" then this probably means that they come from a different universe where there is no time. Thats just my speculation about this dragonflight, and I think they would attack the timelines because it would make it alot easier to destory this universe. User:Invisobills

Mechanical History

Here's an idea, the infinite dragonflight is a result of gnome experiments going horribly wrong. The gnomes, much like in some futuristic movies, succeed in creating an artificial intelligence, which than rebels against its controllers, and runs away from Azeroth to another planet. There, it discovers a large group of dragon eggs, and begins to experiment on the eggs. It also places itself into a machine that it calls a plaat, which allows it to more easily manipulate the dragons. Because this artificial intelligence was created in Ironforge, it has a dislike of orcs, and a suspicion of dragons, so enjoys creating disturbances relating to orcs and dragons. Once the dragon experiments produce good results, the plaat looks through its history, and finds events to experiment with the dragons on. The plaat device sends out these dragons, twho end up causing trouble in the caverns of time instances.

(Yes, this is just me being silly, but it does seem unlikely, that the infinite dragonflight will show up anywhere else besides the instances, and it does seem to pretty much be a plot device unrelated tio anything else in the game.)Minionman 16:43, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

I SERIOUSLY doubt it would be gnomes... their creations are mechanical and robotic, remember? But who, we ask ourselves, has experimented with Dragons before? Nefarian, the son of Deathing, Neltharion the Earthwarder. I have a feeling that a lot of things will be made clear when Deathwing finally comes out into the open. ~My rage bar is blue and I start the fight pissed - Peregrine 16:15, 8 February 2008 (UTC)

Read the words "plaat device" out loud, and I think you'll understand better where this idea comes from. (It is meant to be kind of a silly idea that kind of sounds like it could make sense, to basically have fun with where I really think the infinite dragonflight comes from.) Minionman 17:43, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

I am Peregrine... I have no sense of humour. ~My rage bar is blue and I start the fight pissed - Peregrine 20:24, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

War of the Ancients Insight

This is probably incredibly unlikely, but in Sundering Nozdormu apologizes to Krasus and Rhonin for the trouble that he will cause them and that he is destined to become as Malygos is. Now, as far as I know, neither in Day of the Dragon nor War of the Ancients is he that much trouble to them. True he sends them on a rather inconvenient quest, but it was for their good (as well as all realities good), so I doubt that is what he is refering to. Maybe in the future he eventually goes nuts like Malygos and tries to change his policy of preserving time as it is, and instead warps his flight into the infinite flight. It's a longshot, but I have yet to find a good reason for Nozy to have said that. Meneldir 03:40, 7 February 2008 (UTC)

Hmm... yet another fascinating insight. I think you might just have hit on it - even if it wasn't Nozdormu himself doing it directly, as the Aspect of Time, I wonder what his going insane might do to Time itself, or his flight? ~My rage bar is blue and I start the fight pissed - Peregrine 16:13, 8 February 2008 (UTC)

Well, as for Time itself, I'm not sure it would change, as Malygos' insanity hasn't done all that to magic itself (as far as we know, future revelations may prove me wrong there). There are a few possibilites: Nozdormu himself could do the 180 and be behind all this, or you helpd me see another possibillity here. Mally's insanity mostly made him reclusive and deranged, not to mention lazy, but he wasn't necessarily a threat to the world (until now). Perhaps Nozy will go into that reclusive lethargic state and simply shirk his responsibillities and let things go. If so, maybe some upstart within the flight may try to change things, or someone either within or without the flight may even take his power from him or usurp him or even kill him (all of this being in the future). Again, it's all a longshot, but we'll find out. Meneldir 17:59, 8 February 2008 (UTC)