If you wish to discuss the subject itself, please use Talk:Kael'thas Sunstrider/Analysis. Non-editorial comments made here should be moved to the Analysis page.
Does Kil'jaeden count as a relative? I don't think he should be listed as one, but I'd rather not edit the article until I find out more opinions on the matter... - Aladara 19:14, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
No, I think that would be too much of a stretch, especially given how little info we have. User:Kirkburn/Sig3 19:37, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
Agreed, thanks for making the change! - Aladara 23:17, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
Should we include Eldin Sunstrider as a possible relative?We have little informatio on this but i don't think it would be a mistake.Opinions?(Marakanis)
Never heard of him... is he a younger brother? - Aladara 15:56, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
It's a random name for Blood Mage in WC3TFT. I think it's not so necessary. --N'Nanz 16:13, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
Does the random names from Warcraft III actually represent a real person? I have always had the feeling they were just random names, with no support from the lore. --Odolwa 21:04, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
We don't include them as lore characters, but they can be listed on their "type" pages. User:Kirkburn/Sig3 21:22, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
I heard someone say somewhere he had (or has) a wife. Is this true?
Mr.X8 01:49, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
I've never heard that said and it isn't mentioned in the article at all, so I'm going to go with "no". - Aladara 02:32, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
Speculations?
I should probably just get up the guts to start editing things myself, but better safe than sorry... is this section *really* necessary? It makes no sense at all and on top of that is incredibly poorly worded and formatted. I'd rather not start an editing war on accident, so I figured I'd just ask first... - Aladara 21:50, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
Semirg's speculation
Kael's pact with the burning Legion is an odd one. Many things fall into place shortly Before/After his joining. The Scryers break away from Kael and the Naaru comes into the possesion of the Hordes Blood Elfs. Siphoning power from the Naaru the Blood Elfs belive they are stealing power. But the Naaru of Shattrath show no hate towards these Blood Knights despite what they do to their own brother. Also no Escape, Rescue, or struggle is made to or against the Naaru of Silvermoon City. It may be possible that Kael seeing his people were dying made a pact with A'dal asking him to save his people. In return Kael joins the Legion as a double agent getting close to the legions leader so he can leak information or destory the leaders. The Blood Knights in the meanwhile continue to "steal" The power and what was once the arcane enegry in the Blood Elf body is now Divine energy. Changing the resource of magic to something that wont corrupt them and slowly save the Blood Elf race.—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Semirg (talk · contr).
Entirely possible, and I quite like the idea, but I dislike such lengthy analyses in the articles, particularly when there is little, even in the way of hearsay, to support. --Ragestorm (talk · contr) 01:22, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
It would make sense. My only concern though, then why are we attacking Kael'thas in Tempest Keep? It's under orders from A'dal, you know. --Odolwa 22:30, 19 October 2007 (UTC)
Maybe Kael eventually broke the pact and that's why u get to attack his base(Marakanis 15:30, 20 October 2007 (UTC))
Image
I think I prefer the Samwise. Any thoughts? --Ragestorm (talk · contr) 04:13, 2 November 2007 (UTC)
As do I, since he's the focus of that image. Kirkburntalkcontr 04:35, 2 November 2007 (UTC)
I think the current might be fanart, unless someone else can find it somewhere. That said, I also prefer the Samwise. --User:Sky2042/Sig 04:38, 2 November 2007 (UTC)
Not fanart. it's part of the image that includes Illidan, Vashj, and Akama blizz used at blizzcon. Regardless i think the samwise was more appropriate.
Presumed leaders of the Illidari - Illidan, Kael'thas, Lady Vashj and Akama.
The reason I thought to replace it was because the Samwise image was also frequently used as just a generic blood mage. I had thought the new image would be better suited for a number of reasons, because it's more recent, because it's specifically Kael and no one else, and because it's much darker and as such better represents Kael's current stage of character progression. Though I seem to be the only one that thinks so. Dylan Bissel 15:33, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
The name of the samewise artwork is "Blood Mage", but it is officially specifically of Kael'thas (Manual of Monsters). It is called Blood Mage for the main reason that Kael'Thas was the very first Blood Mage. It is not a "generic individual". The new image is far too abstract for an infobox image.Baggins 16:49, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
I'm aware of the Manual of Monsters, however the image first introduced as just generic blood mage art (on the Frozen Throne website), and then titled "Blood Mage" on Samwise's personal site. And it's kind of odd, if Didier was in fact specifically doing art of Kael that he wouldn't say so. In any other case I'm aware of that he did art for specific characters he has. The image was likely used in the Manual of Monsters only because no art existed at the time of Kael.
Also, I'm curious what you mean by abstract.Dylan Bissel 18:31, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
[1] If an image is the headline image of on a character article in the trump card of all lore sources, then it typically means that it's of the individual in question.
I don't think the other image is abstract, I think just think it's not good enough for the head of the article- it's not a detailed portrait, it wasn't meant to be viewed at so close a range--Ragestorm (talk · contr) 21:32, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
Like I said, I do realize that the image has been used as an image of Kael, however it's also been used as an image of a generic blood mage. Since there was no discernible difference between the two in Frozen Throne it largely renders the image viable for either use. I had been asking Baggins about the image being abstract.
I'm not trying to fight you guys on this or anything, I'd just like to understand the reasons behind your choices so I can better work around them in the future. Dylan Bissel 23:35, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
Technically, it hasn't really been used as a generic "Blood Mage" as officially we have really only encountered one blood mage in the games.(not counting the random blood mages in the multiplayer games). Truth be told Kael is the representive "generic blood mage".Baggins 03:15, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
Secondly, I'd like to point out that Warcraft Encyclopedia is not the "trump card of all warcraft sources" its just "another source" actually part of the History of Warcraft, it is a source that is rarely updated mind you). Going by what Metzen has said in interviews all the sources are generally equal, although what goes on inside the games themselves is probably the highest level.Baggins 03:18, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
"De jure"?
My edit comment got cut off, but what I meant to say there was that someone apparently had "du jour" mixed up with "de facto" and came up with "de jure." It is now fixed.
Is there a source confirming that this image is Kael'thas if not it doesn't need to be in the article.
At [2] the image is called Interrogation. Zakolj 22:58, 19 December 2007 (UTC)
Which of course doesn't confirm its Kael'thas, all it states is the name of the picture is "interrogation" it could be any blood elf blood mage interrogating what looks like a jungle troll.Baggins 21:10, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
I'm not suggesting it is. It was in the article and I removed it, it already had the text under it, and maybe someone who added it or someone else knows of an article in the RPG or other official sources with Kael'thas mentioned and the image on the same page, which would comforme it, and in that case it won't matter it is named Interrogation at SotS. Zakolj 21:46, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
The image is in the A&HC, however its just an article discussing all blood elves.Baggins 21:47, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
It looks like a bound orc screaming for mercy to me; which would fit with the "interrogation" theme. --User:Vorbis/Sig 15:43, 21 December 2007 (UTC)
From a 25-Man Raid to a 5-Man Dungeon...Hmm
I'm admittedly a little confused here. Kael'thas is supposed to be the big man in the TK raid (which I have yet to do...*grumble*), but they're knocking him down to a 5-man. My question is how - unless the battle against him in the TK raid weakened him so much that he needed to be revived with this fel crystal thing which reduces his powers to a 5-man group... *shrug* --Joshmaul 21:01, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
I think what actually happened was he was severely weakened after his defeat at Tempest Keep, and he would be dead by now if it weren't for the crystal. It's some sort of life support, without it he'll probably die. Zentyr 10:32, 21 December 2007 (UTC)
Eh actually we don't know for sure if we'll even get to fight him , and if we will get to fight him he'll probably appear at the 25 man wing of the instance where Kil will get summoned , also if he got weakened when he was almost killed then I guess he'll get healed back to full health again ...my opinion (Marakanis 15:32, 21 December 2007 (UTC))
Oh sorry I didn't see the Sunwell Plateau article , sorry(Marakanis 15:39, 21 December 2007 (UTC))
Note that instance size and level does not always (well, ever) represent actual power. Van Cleef is barely over level 20, yet he's on par with many a level 60 boss. Kirkburntalkcontr 17:51, 24 December 2007 (UTC)
In what way, Kirkburn? --Joshmaul 07:47, 27 December 2007 (UTC)
Really IS nuts
Kaplan says: "This time he really IS nuts"...
I guess this means Kael is, finally, beyond any kind of redemption, and will eventually end up killed in his own homeland as a lackey of the Legion. That's very sad indeed... s-windstalker 03:56, 24 December 2007 (UTC)
My confidence in the lore-department is now finally completely broken. Who knows what more loved, former-good, characters will end up mercilessly slaughtered at the hand of us players?--Odolwa 11:39, 24 December 2007 (UTC)
I don't know, it looks like the developers are getting more of a say in what happens with the lore than creative development. :/ --Super Bhaal 14:46, 24 December 2007 (UTC)
Making good lore =/= keeping characters alive. People die. Kirkburntalkcontr 17:46, 24 December 2007 (UTC)
Point of note Kael & his first blood elves was considered nuts even before we first saw him in Lordaeron in TFT, ;). Some of the last remaining high elves living there were totally against his burning of forests in what is now Ghostlands.
The surviving elves frighten me, Melena. They no longer call themselves high elves. You remember Prince Kael’Thas? He leads the elves now, being the last elf of noble birth. He calls his people “blood elves,” supposedly in homage of the dead. I am glad they no longer think of themselves as high elves, for they certainly are not. Melena, they plan to raze the forest - all of it! “We will not let the Scourge enjoy their plunder!” declares Kael’Thas. Travesty! I will try to stop this folly, but I doubt that I will be successful. These blood elves are crazed, manic, inflamed by vengeance and fueled by this unnamable need that seethes within our consciousness. They will go on with their plans despite my efforts. They may even try to slay me. Yet I will do what I can.Template:Cite
I don't know about you but I STILL think he has a chance of redeeming himself ... or at least stay alive a little more . BTW Baggins who's the character that is talking to "Melena" ?(Marakanis 00:53, 28 December 2007 (UTC))
Can I ask where and when Kael found these three green spheres and what they represent? Simple catalizers of power or are they the prison of some "devils" like the big green crystals with eyes back at Silvermoon? (someone screamed from the kitchen that they may probably be "imps'in'a'ball", /lol) --File:IconLarge Troll Male.gifRavenore , the Necroshadowmancer 03:32, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
His name is Ramao, Marakanis. ...and judging from Brann's account he was actually burned alive, turned into a charred skeleton by the blood elves before he could even send the letter off.Baggins 06:11, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
King Kael'thas?
I noticed that his title is "the Sun King" yet it still refers to him as "Prince Kael'thas." Should this be edited so he is "King Kael'thas"? Forgive me if this has been asked before. Zentyr 21:16, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
If I understand things correctly, Kael'thas is a de facto king of the Blood Elves. It's just that he havn't yet gone through the crowning proceduares required in order to call himself king. "Sun King" is probably a self-proclaimed title.--Odolwa 15:09, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
The Horde-affiliated blood elves refer to him as Prince Kael'thas...and for some reason, so do a few of Kael's minions (Ambassador Solannas, Warden Mellichar, etc.) I think the "Sun King" bit is something that Kael'thas calls himself, sort of like Thermaplugg calling himself King of Gnomeregan. Ego and all that. As far as I'm aware, he remains uncrowned - officially, anyway. --Joshmaul 09:22, 7 January 2008 (UTC)
Regarding the Two Instances He's In
I have a question: Is Kael'thas the only boss that appears in two instances? Actually, let me rephrase that: Is he the only boss you can FIGHT in two instances? I know Nefarian's human form appears in UBRS, but you can't actually fight him until BWL. I thought there might have been another, but I'm not sure; I think Kael's also the only one who appears in a normal (well, heroic version of a normal) instance as well as a raid instance. Can anyone confirm or deny? --Joshmaul 14:57, 18 January 2008 (UTC)
There's Hakkar. You fight his avatar in Sunken Temple and then his physical body in Zul'Gurub. Zentyr 15:28, 21 January 2008 (UTC)
Sign your posts. So Kael'thas does only appear in the Heroic version of Magister's Terrace? :S Sound strange to me.--Odolwa 12:37, 19 January 2008 (UTC)
He might appears only in Heroic version.--User:FireMaster/Sig1 13:10, 19 January 2008 (UTC)
Blah, forgot to sign that time. Apologies. Yes, right now he is only in the Heroic mode. Zentyr 15:28, 21 January 2008 (UTC)
