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This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Onyxia article.

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Link Edit

I added a link to Onyxia's Lair, since that seems to be a more useful page. --Abaddon 12:05, 19 Jul 2005 (EDT)

I will add a picture of Onyxia as Lady Katrana Prestor later Jemimus 08:56, 9 Jul 2005 (EDT)


There seems to be no mention of preparation. What sort of level should players be? Is ZG gear enough, or should they have completed MC several times? How much FR should be there? (for casters/melee/MT?) How do you know when your guild is ready to begin? Does anyone even read this stuff? ;) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by KelvinFrost (talk · contr).

Onyxia Aggro Reset in Phase 3 ? Edit

My guild has done Onyxia a few times and when we use KTM the aggro just doesn't seem to make sense fully. From what we can understand - Aggro is actually reset when Phase 3 starts.

Thoughts?

As for the "preparation" I would suggest you to of at least gone into MC a few times. IE: Kill up to Gehennas once or twice and gear up the MT first, in doing so. Your MT will have decent gear for tanking and will mean you can survive Onyxia a bit more.

Oh, Mana / Health pots are a must as well. --Daworm 09:00, 18 August 2006

I believe the Phase 3 Abilities - Heal section is incorrect. Onyxia can and does evade-bug when someone is on the ledges to the northwest and northeast. --Ziana 12:58, 1 September 2006 (EDT)
We had that healing as well and we had a player on the ledge for a short time. Thus, I tend to confirm that it only happens when people are on the ledges --bwh 07:53, 27 September 2006 (EDT)
Standing on the ledges allows you to avoid the fear somewhat.. but onyxia can and WILL evade and heal herself.
Have hunter stand on the 2 spikes behind her, rather than on the ledges. CJ 04:08, 28 September 2006 (EDT)
I've seen her do the heal without anyone on the ledges, but it sounds like the ledges can cause it. I adjusted the wording to reflect this. I've never seen the "Evade" text. She's not supposed to evade. If there's someone she can't reach, she summons him instead. Of course, just because she isn't supposed to do it doesn't mean that she won't. Computer programs can and do have bugs.
A group capable of getting to Onyxia will be capable of downing her if they execute the strategy perfectly...except that the main tank must have a lot of fire resistance gear.
There is some sort of a major aggro reset that happens during Phase 2 or at the start of Phase 3. It's not clear exactly when this happens, but it's certainly before she lands, and probably before she emotes her start to Phase 3. It's not clear how complete the reset is. She certainly carries over a good bit of aggro from somewhere, because the tank can't just walk up to her and get aggro like at the start of Phase 1. The best theory I've seen is that she does a hate reduction each time she moves in Phase 2.
Kathucka 09:35, 29 September 2006 (PDT).

Strategy outdated Edit

Tell me if I am wrong, but hasn't the encounter with Onyxia changed since last patch, and the same strategy can't be used anymore? -- LarsPensjo 09:40, 5 September 2006 (EDT)

Nope. The encounter hasn't changed recently.
--Kathucka 12:46, 29 September 2006 (EDT)

Reverting changes Edit

Reverted changes from Galzohar. Some of his additions are probably valuable. However, there is so much wrong here that it is much simpler to get rid of it all. To wit:

I think he may have been attempting to play a 'prank' on all those looking for tactics on here - thanks for noticing and sorting it out! :) -- Kirkburn (talk) 08:39, 11 October 2006 (EDT)

Wrong Stuff Reverted Edit

Hideous capitalization. The first letter of a sentence is capitalized.

Typos.

No, the warders are not on a normal respawn timer. The warders spawn right away when you engage Onyxia. This is a triggered event.

No, her flame breath is not cone-shaped. It goes straight out sideways from her head. I know, because I thought it was cone-shaped, got too far forward, and got nailed.


Whelps don't "seem" to spawn at the start of Phase Two. They do spawn then and throughout the phase.

No, you can't prevent Deep Breath attacks. It's a myth. Every technique, no matter how deeply people believe in it, has been shown to not work. Her Deep Breath attacks are triggered randomly, and not based on anything players can do. The only thing you can do is reduce the amount of time she is in the air, so she'll do it less.

No, you probably shouldn't go only for fire resistance and ignore everything else. For example, being able to do DPS is very important, especially during Phase Two and for the second half of Phase Three. A good player will get the right mix of everything he needs.

No, she hasn't changed in any recent patch, although she did have a bad bug after one a long time ago.

No, healers can run out of mana if they don't know what they're doing. Onyxia can do a lot of damage, especially if she gets some crushing blows. That's why healers should have a rotation.

Presumably, any healer who gets to this fight knows how to take care of a mage doing AoE.

Patches frequently break add-ons. You're supposed to update them. Updated add-ons work fine when giving the Deep Breath warnings.

No, tanks should not start Phase Three with a full rage bar. They should burn their rage near the end of Phase Two by putting Sunder Armor on Onyxia. Remember that Phase Three starts right as Onyxia hits 40%, not as she lands (which is later).

No, you can't always go all-out DPS after 10-30 seconds in Phase Three. Depending on what the tank was able to do at the end of Phase Two, he might not have enough hate. With Onyxia's Knock Away ability reducing aggro, going all-out that early can cause the DPS to steal aggro and cause a wipe. I've seen it happen.

Possibly Good Stuff Reverted Edit

Do the lava spurts cause further fear effects? I don't think they do. Can anyone confirm?


Maybe normal melee attacks can reach her when she's in flight. Maybe not. Who can confirm this?

special attacks only.
whoever changed that,,, hasnt tried this himself.
User:Galzohar seems to have added these "views" rather than facts.
You can not prevent deep breath, you can however avoid it,, by running to the sides. You can reduce it's frequency,, by nuking her fast, any other method,, is not tested.

CJ 07:47, 11 October 2006 (EDT)

Updated Edit

If you're going to add a comment here, click the "+" link next to the "Edit" link up there.

Ok, I reverted the change so now it's clear that only special attacks can reach Onyxia in the air.

We have to put the "Bugged Heal" somewhere better. Maybe down at the bottom in its own section....

I also removed the nonsense about lava cracks causing chain fears. --Kathucka 12:20, 12 October 2006 (EDT)

Abilities? Edit

Doesn't Onyxia have a Cleave ability? Not sure here, since I'm always too far away to have that show up in my combat log....

Does her Wing Buffet ability work the same as the Blackwing Lair version? It's not the same as Knock Away, which she clearly has.

--Kathucka 11:46, 13 October 2006 (EDT)

did the Chosen guild of Korea really make the first kill? Edit

just curious... —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Didigo10 (talk · contr).

Combat log contemplation Edit

After gazing carefully at the combat log this weekend....

Her tail attack is called "Tail Sweep" and does indeed do around 300 damage.

She has a Cleave attack. I didn't record the damage.

She has a Knock Away attack. It's rare and it does damage.

She has a Wing Buffet attack. It's separate from the Knock Away attack and it does damage.

The attack from the lava cracks is called "Eruption" and it does around 1500 damage unresisted.

Can anyone check the log and report how much damage the Wing Buffet, Knock Away, and Cleave do? I'm not sure when I'll visit Onyxia again.

Oh, and yes. It was a Korea guild that got Onyxia first. They had a head start, as they were able to use their Beta characters in the Retail version of the game. I don't know the name of the guild. --Kathucka 12:59, 30 October 2006 (EST)

Six or Eight postions in Phase 2? Edit

I've never seen her stop over a whelp cave. This would imply that she has six positions where she can stop, not eight. Can anyone confirm?

Also, Wiki linking gets messed up if two sections have the same name ("Positioning"). Can someone change it back?

Also, the instructions for what to do and where to go for a Deep Breath belong in the Phase 2 Strategy section, not the Phase 2 Abilities section. Can someone move it? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Kathucka (talk · contr).

Deep breaths are random Edit

Please stop putting in false information about how to stop Deep Breath attacks. The only theory that hasn't been disproven is that they are random.

If you do manage to figure out how to prevent them, fine. However, you're going to have to test it, provide evidence and discuss it, first. "My guild kept up a lot of debuffs and we never got a Deep Breath" is not evidence.

The theory about the fireballs being a complete wipe is an exciting one. Please see http://www.curse-gaming.com/en/wow/addons-3488-1-klhthreatmeter.html for details. --Kathucka 13:35, 30 November 2006 (EST)

I actually created an account just to fix this. Random is completly impossible, especially the numbers given in the list. My guild hasn't had a deep breath in atleast the last 18 oni kills (I can't remember one recently, and i'm using 6oni kills/mo (every 5 days) assuming I can remember back 3 months) The idea that there is a 30% chance when she moves that she does a deep breath is so amazingly wrong. From personal experience I guess that it's minimum dps/debuffs, it can't be clumping due to the way my guilds oni strategy works (all rogues follow her around spamming SS/Rupture and once the whelps are done so do the warriors, which results in a clump of about 10-11 people directly under her). SeraphimXI 01:45, 5 December 2006 (EST)
We nuked her down from 100% -> 0% in less than 6 minutes, high dps from the start, tank using thunderfury, no deepbreath. if you take "long" or don't keep her busy enough.. e.g. not enough people high enough on the aggro list so that the average aggro of the raid is lower than a certain %, she'll be more likely to use deep breath. Keep her under heavy fire.  - CJ talk / cont  02:53, 5 December 2006 (EST)
If Blizzard themselves have refuted the "DPS-claim" and openly said both on forums and in interviews that it is random, we can assume it is random. Some people get lucky and some people don't.AzaAza

No, really, it's random Edit

Brady Games asserts that it's a 30% chance. It states that it's 35% move left, 35% move right, and 30% Deep Breath. This is an official strategy guide. That's where the number came from. Their guides are notoriously inaccurate with numbers, but they generally get the basics right.

If you've killed her that many times, chances are that you kill her so fast that she doesn't move very many times, and thus never gets off a deep breath. I've never seen her perform a Deep Breath at the start of the fight. It's possible that she is programmed not to do it the first minute of Phase 2. I've certainly never seen her do it that quickly.

If you can nuke her from 65% to 40% in a minute or two, she won't move that many times, and chances are that she will never have the chance to do the attack. Also, with the thousands of raiding guilds out there, it is expected for randomness to result in some guilds never getting any Deep Breath attacks.

If you report that you've killed her many times or that you kill her very quickly and that she never performs a Deep Breath, you're providing evidence in favor of randomness, because it shows that getting her on the ground quickly prevents the attack.

If you really want to prove that your technique works, simply leave her up in the air for 15 minutes while you use your technique, and see what happens. That will be actual evidence. You won't be able to prove anything if you leave her up there for less three minutes or so. If you're not willing to do this, then your theory does not have any evidence superior to the straight random chance theory. Please do not report your theory without such evidence.

Also, if you wish to add a comment here, please click on the little + (Plus Sign) button up there.

--Kathucka 18:37, 7 December 2006 (EST)

It cannot be random. If it was a 30% chance that means each time she moves there is a 30% chance she will do a Deep Breath. If that was the case killing her quickly is irrelevant, since the first time she moves there is a 3/10 chance she will do a Deep Breath, the second time another 3/10 chance. If you use probability, assuming she has a 30% chance to do a Deep breath when she moves, if she moves twice times during a fight (which is extremely low), there is a 49% chance of atleast one deep breath. (1-((7/10)(7/10))=.49) that is simply impossible to be correct. Your saying that somehow killing her quickly prevents Deep Breaths, however probability shows that even if she moves 3 times odds are that she will deep breath, which is simply not true. The guide is old, and outdated, and wrong. SeraphimXI 13:57, 12 December 2006 (EST)
The idea that the reason people don't see deep breaths because they kill her too fast confirms that it cannot be random. Since it's impossible to kill her without her moving atleast once, and there is a 3/10 chance of her doing a deep breath on her first move according to you, if the event is random it would be impossible to prevent her from Deep breathing due to killing her fast, the odds of it occouring simply go down, however as I showed above the odds are about 50/50 she will deep breath atleast once before she moves for the 3rd time according to your numbers. SeraphimXI 14:04, 12 December 2006 (EST)

Push the Plus (+) button Edit

Please click on the "+" link next to "edit this page" to add a comment. Don't click on any of the "edit" buttons. It's possible that she has a grace period before launching her Deep Breath attacks, and that it's random after that. If the grace period is a minute, and there are guilds that take her down in less than a minute, those guilds will never get a deep breath. Please note that the text mentions this possibility. Right now, Random is the best we have. All other theories have been tested and have failed. Until you have a better theory, please leave the Random theory up there. If you have a better theory, please test it by leaving her up there for 15 minutes. If you can prevent Deep Breath attacks for 15 minutes with your technique, you have some much-needed evidence. Please provide this evidence and then post it. If you have no evidence, please don't edit. Reverting changes now. --Kathucka 14:26, 12 December 2006 (EST)

FYI, the + button is for a new topic, not a new comment. WhiteBoy 16:36, 12 December 2006 (EST)
It's actually up to you to prove the random theory. As long as the article doesn't say that the actual cause is unknown, it's 100% accurate. What you keep reverting to, is provably incorrect. SeraphimXI 10:18, 14 December 2006 (EST)
I once fought her with a newly formed raiding guild. We got roughly 5+ deep breaths and eventually wiped. So the raid leader issued a help request and asked the GM for help and wanted to know if she might be bugged. The GM told us he would watch and check it out. Again we got several deep breaths and wiped. After that the GM stated: "Everything works as intended, you might want to try a different tactic. More I'm not allowed to say." So if deep breaths can be avoided or minimized by "tactic", they surely aren't random.--FallingDown 14:51, 8 January 2007 (EST)

tactic seperationEdit

Like all other major boss and character articles I suggest we move the tactics out to its own topic Onyxia (tactics) and put up a disambig notice at the top, in order to limit this page to lore and quest information only.Baggins 16:33, 1 January 2007 (EST)

I have to concur. --Sky2042 03:44, 13 January 2007 (EST)

FanartEdit

Changed the fan art being used in infobox to comply with fanart policy.Warthok 21:05, 19 September 2007 (UTC)

Onyxia2

Fanart: Onyxia by Judy Schmidt (Geckzilla)


Shall we use this image from the Trading Card Game:Dakovski 06:25, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

OnyxiaTCG

Onyxia and the Defias Edit

With the new additions to the missing diplomat questline in 2.3 it seems to infer that Onyxia and the Black Dragonflight are involved with the Defias and the kidnapping of the King. During the questline you're sent on a recon of Alcaz Island where now a black dragon is seen flying around. Then when Jaina sends to to report to Bolvar in Stormwind, Lady Prestor makes a comment about how unnecessary further investigation would be implying that she's trying to hide something. The questline still ends pretty abruptly so who knows how it'll play out. I could add to this the lore in the article but I'm new to editing a wiki so I want to post here first.
Tarnfair 06:08, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Feel free to add it. If someone doesn't like it, it will be removed. ;) --Sky (t · c · w) 06:10, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
I completely agree that it should be added. That quest continuation was beautiful, and gave me much resolution over "The Missing Diplomat"... and came as a suprise to know that the Defias and Black Dragonflight were working together. I love it. But yeah, the quest basically confirms it 100% Gamepro777 16:56, 17 November 2007 (UTC)

So where is she now? Edit

Article says she is in Stormwind, but she seemed to have moved on with Wotlk. Hopefully not dead (you people just killed an impostor in that dank cave!) --Crash (talk) 01:00, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

Lorewise, she's now dead. Varian killed her with the help of Jaina, Thargas Anvilmar, Broll, and Valeera. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 01:03, 3 January 2009 (UTC)
Evidently not... --Joshmaul (talk) 05:24, 13 August 2009 (UTC)
Lorewise, she's still dead. Zarhym even said this is really just a fun treat to celebrate WoW's fifth anniversary. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 05:27, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

Return for lv 80 ?Edit

I didn't understood exactly watt blizzard said, they mentioned changing her Raid to 10 men and 25 men but dose that mean we get lv 80 loot or its just for dose lv 60 ? even the thing with changing the fight to be with wotlk boss mechanics that confused me, can someone clarify ? --DarckArchon Might of Aiur 09:07, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

They're retuning the entire encounter, including the loot, for level 80. The level 60 version will cease to exist at that time. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 09:23, 13 August 2009 (UTC)
Just like Naxxramas (original) became Naxxramas, I suggest Onyxia (original) for the old one and keep Onyxia (tactics) for the comming one.
IconSmall Hamuul Loremaster A'noob, Arch Druid of the Noobhoof Clan (talk/contribz) 15:34, 18 August 2009 (UTC)
Talk:Onyxia (original)#Move suggestion. User:Coobra/Sig4 19:35, 18 August 2009 (UTC)
That link is bad (even though it's blue), and I don't see any topics on this page with that heading. Just Alerting You Small Howbizr(t·c) 1:53 PM, 21 Aug 2009 (EDT)
Fixed.
The Old Lady was moved from Onyxia (tactics) to Onyxia (original) where she can lay to rest forever.
IconSmall Hamuul Loremaster A'noob, Arch Druid of the Noobhoof Clan (talk/contribz) 17:56, 21 August 2009 (UTC)

Undead Onyxia Edit

I found the source for her new model in cata (http://static.mmo-champion.com/mmoc/images/news/2010/cataclysm/cataclysm_models/onyxiaundead.jpg). Should this be put as the citation? Or because it's from mmochamp, should it be left as needing citation or removed? Saberd (talk) 20:01, July 1, 2010 (UTC)

Aka... datamined, ok thank you. User:Coobra/Sig4 20:01, July 1, 2010 (UTC)
I heard dialogues of Nefarian from BWD (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHnWLcQjOGA) and there he says, that he was standing after resurrection of Onyxia. I wonder if she'll be new raid boss...for the third time :) Or maybe a fight with Onyxia and Nefarian at once? We'll see that. Morpheius (talk) 23:15, July 21, 2010 (UTC)
Could be. But, like the image, it's datamined. We'll see what happens when Blackwing Descent is open on the beta server. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 00:14, July 22, 2010 (UTC)
Which generally means "stop posting crap about Onyxia in Cataclysm until we actually SEE her in Cataclysm". --Joshmaul (talk) 01:50, July 22, 2010 (UTC)
The model was shown at this year's Blizzcon so I guess it can be treated as open information but we can't say what she is doing or where she is currently just yet.--Saphiredragon89 (talk) 23:37, October 24, 2010 (UTC)
She's now in beta BLackwing Descent. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BjVD_HldD5M) Llamaman201 (talk) 19
12, October 29, 2010 (UTC)

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