Talk: Sargeras/Archive1

Revision as of 21:04, 30 March 2011

Leaving a question/comment in the middle of the page and not at the bottom will be ignored.

Past discussions archived to...

...User talk:Coobra/Archive01 Archived Nov 2007 to May 2008
...User talk:Coobra/Archive02 Archived June 2008 to May 2009
...User talk:Coobra/Archive03 Archived June 2009 to August 2009
...User talk:Coobra/Archive04 Archived September 2009 to November 2009
...User talk:Coobra/Archive05 Archived November 2009 to March 2010
...User talk:Coobra/Archive06 Archived March 2010 to July 2010
...User talk:Coobra/Archive07 Archived August 2010 to

Faction Icons

I was wondering if you could make more faction icons like this one but for the main enemy faction of the expansion, currently 2 which have defined icons(since i don't know what the heck happened in the Burning crusade), the Scourge and the Twilight Hammer, just those 2--Ashbear160 (talk) 00:38, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

The Main enemy factions only:

...Pictures too big if anybody knows how to make them smaller plz fix it...

--Ashbear160 (talk) 00:41, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

Not exactly sure why they would be needed... only reason Scryers and Aldor got them was because you could align yourself or be hostile with them. Whereas the Scourge and Twilight members would always be hostile, for the most part.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 04:16, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

Can you make them? It's annoying having to use neutral icons to represent the big bad factions of the expansion--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:55, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

If someone will do this not forget the Illidari... (I never see a standard of the Burning Legion):

After if you want to undertand what happened in "WoW: TBC" see War in Outland(Gabrirt (talk) 21:10, 29 November 2010 (UTC))

Hell you Coobra!

I and my friend adore you as a diety. "lying quietly in awe with my forehead against the floor". —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Teonod (talk · contr).

Hmm... time for a sacrificial gnome.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 07:45, 5 December 2010 (UTC)

The coobra-god has spoken. I will make a Gnome and kill him in your name. Teonod

Thousand Needles

Did you want me to cite sources when adding that information? The revert button is usually reserved for vandals... Needle in a Haystack (talk) 07:52, 5 December 2010 (UTC)

It's an unneeded comment and completely irrelevant.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 07:54, 5 December 2010 (UTC)

heirloom shouder chants

can also use aldor/scryer chants on heirloom shoulders —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Doug105 (talk · contr).

No clue, probably not.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 21:30, 6 December 2010 (UTC)

Quick question, sorry to bother you.

Would you mind me using your charcter page for your Night Elf Hunter as a template for my own character in game, I'm not a RPer but I like creative writing and would like permission to both use the page as a template and the permission to add the page in general.

Many thanks Extractum (talk · contr)--Paladin-General of Stormwind 11:41, 6 December 2010 (UTC)

I don't mind.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 21:31, 6 December 2010 (UTC)

Frontal view

Hello! I've seen the better image requests. I can take another one for Sergeant Houser without problems, but Alyssa Blaye and Travist Bosk (as well as Eldin Partridge) are close facing the practice dummies, and I think it will be difficult to obtain a better image. Anyhow, I'll try. Bye :) --Forco (talk) 11:49, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

Ah, I knew there had to be reason. If you can get better shots, thank you, if it's not possible go ahead and remove the cleanup tag and state in the edit summary something like, "not possible".

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 07:53, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

Done for Sergeant Houser; in the file page I still see the old image, while in the NPC's page I see the new one, and I don't understand why. For the other three, I think that's the better I can do. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Forco (talk · contr).

It does that occasionally.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 16:24, 10 December 2010 (UTC)

Image problems

I tried to update a photo and for some reason i ended up with the older version and not the new one. The Alchemic Warrior of Travels (talk) 22:34, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

That happens occasionally. It will fix itself in time.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 22:48, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Ok. Well anyways. I was putting some updated photos and seen that before. The Alchemic Warrior of Travels (talk) 22:52, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Ironforge Airport map

You tagged File:Ironforge-Airport.jpg as being a policy violation, but left no explanation that I could find. What is the problem? —MJBurrage^(T•C) 18:29, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

While I know the place is easily accessible by flying mount and a specific flight path, I believe that detailing the path that players can take that involved exploiting the world environment is still against our policy. That is why it's marked as a possible violation and not just deleted.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 23:06, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

How is it an exploit if anyone can walk the path shown? No add-ons, macros, etc. are required, just jumping over obstacles. —MJBurrage^(T•C) 23:18, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

To even start the path one would have to exploit the starting point.... the rest of it may require no effort, but the beginning does.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 23:21, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

How is jumping forward, and then jumping forward again from where you landed an exploit? —MJBurrage^(T•C) 23:23, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

It was an exploit prior to the cataclysm and an exploit now. I'm not going to argue about this. Nothing has changed.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 23:27, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

I am not trying to be argumentative, I really don't see how it is an exploit. Did Blizzard state this was an exploit? How is it any different than getting to Foggy MacKreel? —MJBurrage^(T•C) 23:30, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

Cause he was intended to get to. Jumping down and climbing a mountain are two different things.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 23:32, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

Where does it say that jumping in the mountains is considered an exploit? (real question, again not trying to be argumentative) —MJBurrage^(T•C) 23:36, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

Unused files

Since you seem to be the person who handles this most, please let me know and my apologies if there are any I left behind. Maybe some day I will be experienced enough and seek admin rights so I can clean up after myself. (Or I could just not be so messy in the future.) Thanks. --Bellocois (talk) 21:59, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

No problem, I placed that template just to keep track of the ones that weren't being link to on your page or their own articles. If you do find an image not being used just mark it for speedydelete. =)

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 22:01, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

Thank you

I've always loved the work of the major contributors and I just want to say "thank you" for helping me clean up the articles I've been adding over the past week. I've just been snapping screenshots of every NPC I come across and slowly getting around to adding them as time permits. I always go back and look at the fixes you put in for me and it helps me learn about style and "where stuff goes." Hopefully, one of these days, I'll have a good enough hang of this that I won't leave you so much work to do. Anyways, thanks again for your patience and work. John Yithnal (talk) 16:03, 23 December 2010 (UTC)

Happy to help. =)

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 03:32, 27 December 2010 (UTC)

Count link

Just pointing out, the Count link on your user page links to the "evil wiki who shall not here be named"

Have bright sun shining day!

Loremaster A'noob, Arch Druid of the Noobhoof Clan (^talk/_contribz) 08:18, 26 December 2010 (UTC)

heh, forgot about that. Thank you.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 03:31, 27 December 2010 (UTC)

How do you do Warcraft 2 screenshots without crosshatching on minimap?

Hi, I saw your File:Beetle_Island.jpg (compare to one of my screenshots: img220.imageshack.us/img220/4884/dareregionofthechanneli.png and was wondering, how do you do Warcraft 2 screenshots of the minimap without the crosshatching/fine grid put over on the minimap of areas not currently visible to make them darker?

Even when I use the cheat (press enter type 'showpath' then enter again, that one) it just displays all of the map and stuff that isn't currently being 'seen' by one of your people is greyed out/crosshatched out on the minimap. So not sure how you took that screenshot? Thanks for any info :)

Might be good to post the info on the wiki for others so it's common knowledge, especially if you know how to do the same for the other games like Warcraft 1/3 etc! I have only just been trying them out cos I was curious about the background story behind world of warcraft --Kittymew (talk) 12:30, 31 December 2010 (UTC)

It's been a long time since I uploaded that... I don't even know if I copied it from a badly named file or from battle.net. Either way, I didn't personally take the image.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 04:53, 1 January 2011 (UTC)

Scout Galiaan and friends

I had put the Cataclysm shots in separate locations so the old ones would still be accessible. I can see the logic of what you did since the old version is in the file history, but it still seems more logical to have something we can link directly to and say "This is what the character looked like before Cataclysm." Not that the specifics of Named Guard #439's page matter in the long run, but still. --Bellocois (talk) 03:20, 2 January 2011 (UTC)

If it was a completely new model or completely different look, then I'd say yes, keep an old image to see, but when the only difference is they added a tabard... that's not enough to keep both files. The image history can be viewed if users want to see them without the tabard.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 03:23, 2 January 2011 (UTC)

While I'm here, you tagged some images for deletion that are linked from my user page as being part of my (extended) to-do list. I did upload a bunch recently that I didn't create pages for or link to as needing pages, but I plan to remedy that in the next 24 hours or so. --Bellocois (talk) 03:32, 2 January 2011 (UTC)

Oh no no, that is not the speedy delete tag. That is simply an unused image marker. I use it to keep track of images that are currently not being used in articles. It's also another way for users to see if articles are needed, by seeing there's an image in need of an article. I would never delete those.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 03:34, 2 January 2011 (UTC)

Your opinion is desired

Hey, just wanted to get your opinion on Talk:Archbishop Benedictus about whether or not the "he staged a coup" note from patch 1.4.1 should be considered lore or not. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 20:35, 5 January 2011 (UTC)

Adding my 2 cents. Coobra could you vote in Category talk:Patch templates, regarding the change of icon in Cataclysm Patch templates. I would be very grateful:) Encaitar 22:17, 5 January 2011 (UTC)

Where are they now?

Just hit upon the Where are they now? section of your user site, and it's the most comprehensive of its type so far. I've posted my own MIA lists on the usual forums before, and had been thinking of compiling one myself. In the meantime, I got a response from a GM ticket regarding another MIA character, Arko'narin. — Deepred (talk) 04:54, 10 January 2011 (UTC)

Oh nice =). Did you get a screenshot of the conversation to be used as a reference in case anyone contests it?

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 05:03, 10 January 2011 (UTC)

Indeed I did. I can upload it on request. — Deepred (talk) 06:13, 10 January 2011 (UTC)

Thank you.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 06:32, 10 January 2011 (UTC)

You could probably put this in the main space under an appropriate title, whatever that may be. It has the potential to draw significant attention in the way Horde bias unintentionally did when I created it. Actually, now that I mention that page, it's probably best that you don't move it, let alone let the forums near it. (Kidding. Sort of! :-P) --Bellocois (talk) 08:05, 10 January 2011 (UTC)

Heh.. well I started off wanting to do this during the beta... but after getting into finally doing it... I saw that they were still leaving many NPCs out (to be added later) and with the phasing, I wouldn't be able to just fly through zones looking for specific things.. I'd have to quest through the zones. But new toons come after older toons... so eventually I'll get back to this. I'd just prefer to being able to control it on my userspace, rather than letting it run rampant like Horde/Alliance bias =P.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 08:11, 10 January 2011 (UTC)

User Templates (?)

Not sure if I titled the headline right or not. However I was wondering where I would be able to find more of the

This user plays as a member of the Horde.

objects. I've forgotten the URL and haven't been able to find it on WoWPedia --Alindaloran (talk) 10:52, January 12, 2010

You can look at all "User*" templates here —EGingell^TC Treader of Cenarion Circle 09:28, 13 January 2011 (UTC)

Admiral Nightwing

I said in the summary he needed to be renamed to Admiral Nightwind. Hallowseve (talk) 13:17, 13 January 2011 (UTC)

Admiral Nightwind already existed, hence it's deletion.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 21:34, 13 January 2011 (UTC)

Class thing

It has to be consistent with playable races like the night elves. They have the WoW classes at the top.--Atomos (talk) 01:08, 14 January 2011 (UTC)

And Highborne elves are actually playable so they should count.--Atomos (talk) 01:12, 14 January 2011 (UTC)

Tinkering (Engineering)

I am moved to mirth... having had the page I created turned into a redirect, then deleted to make way for the page it was directing to. I guess I am confirmed in my guess as to the correctness of my choice of name. --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 22:42, 14 January 2011 (UTC)

Aye. I didn't realize Tinkering (Engineering) had also just been made, thought Tinkering (engineering) was a duplicate, but it is the correct name.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 23:40, 14 January 2011 (UTC)

Ayup. Someone ELSE had made Tinkering (Engineering) by the time I came along. And by george, they must have been making it at about the same time I was making mine! --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 00:54, 15 January 2011 (UTC)

According to the logs, Grynd starting making the page 3hrs or so before you. =P

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 01:38, 15 January 2011 (UTC)

Old Mammoth

Heya, could you possibly move the article "Last Weeks Mammoth" to "Last Week's Mammoth"? I know it's only a minor typo, but I still find it somewhat annoying. WoWpedia might be more "human-made" than WoW-databases such as Wowhead which digs data directly, but it should still be on par with it when it comes to names! Also, if possible, it'd be nifty if you could make "Last Weeks Mammoth" redirect to the new page. WrathOfDeathfrost (talk) 22:39, 15 January 2011 (UTC)

Your opinion is desired

Hey Coobra, the Alliance-Horde War article is constantly changed to include Malfurion as an Alliance commander, while hee actually doesn't take part in the conflict similar to Lady Liadrin, Hamuul Runetotem, Varok Saurfang or even Thrall who are not listed. Could you please visit Talk:Alliance–Horde War and discuss. I really think he doesn't fit there, as he is more neutral as leader of Cenarion Circle (just like the 4 Horde commanders who simply do not take part in the war eventhough they're in the Horde). Thanks in advance Encaitar 20:35, 16 January 2011 (UTC)

Well he's not exactly the neutral leader but the alliance representative of the cenarion circle--Ashbear160 (talk) 10:23, 17 January 2011 (UTC)

Sapient race templates

Ugh i'm sorry if i complain too much but it seems gourra doesn't know that the sapient templates are made to fit certain things and he's changing the templates to fit the name of the article, which PCJ named it wrong...--Ashbear160 (talk) 01:38, 18 January 2011 (UTC)

Sorry for being annoyance, but i really took a long time to arrange the templates--Ashbear160 (talk) 01:39, 18 January 2011 (UTC)

Forsaken

Should i change

"Among the tauren the Forsaken found a champion in Magatha Grimtotem, who argued in favor of the alliance between the two peoples and who continues to work closely with them. Magatha claims she merely wants to aid the Forsaken in their quest to redeem themselves, although there are many who believe her true motives to be something very different and much less innocent."

with newer source:

"The kind-hearted tauren of Thunder Bluff proved to be the most promising contact. Specifically, Archdruid Hamuul Runetotem saw the potential for redemption in Sylvanas’ people, even though he was fully aware of the Forsaken’s sinister nature. Thus, the tauren convinced Warchief Thrall, despite his misgivings, to forge an alliance of convenience between the Forsaken and the Horde."

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/game/race/forsaken

Because in Cata Grimtotem and forsaken Relations made no Reference at all The quests could possibly has been retcon and blizzard website changed it from magtha to Hamuul.--Forsakenlord (talk) 22:42, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

Couldn't they both have argued in favor of them...

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 23:08, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

could be however with shattering magtha never called the forsaken to aid her against baine bloodhoof instead asking garrosh aid + forsaken info from new website + No Reference made between the forsaken and Grimtotem + Grimtotem never sought the forsaken aid + Grimtotem Allied with Alliance (forsaken hatred enemy)= retcon? --Forsakenlord (talk) 23:23, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

Wowpedia/World of Warcraft Acheivements thingy or wutever its called

how do you keep those doohickies in a straight column??????Itsuki624 (talk) 06:53, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Edit my page and copy the code the same way you did before... just take all of it, rather than portions.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 06:55, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

I was only editing to find out how to make the pictures,I didn't copy it.And how do you do that snake tail thing??PS.how would i make a thingy for preferring the Horde over the Alliance?Itsuki624 (talk) 07:09, 21 January 2011 (UTC)Itsuki624

Never mind about the signature.I already got that done. Itsuki624 (talk contribs) 21:57, 24 January 2011 (UTC)Itsuki624

Just 4get it all because I have an even liking of races in the factions.I like 3 of the Horde and 3 from the Alliance Itsuki624 (talk contribs) 23:50, 26 January 2011 (UTC)Itsuki624

In fact,I used those 6 to make my own small faction.I'm making a userbox for it,but im having problems with the pics. Itsuki624 (talk contribs Lord of the Elves) 09:28, 28 January 2011 (UTC)Itsuki624

Guardian of Ancient kings

Could you make an article for the creature instead of the ability? plz--Ashbear160 (talk) 19:20, 17 January 2011 (UTC)

plz?--Ashbear160 (talk) 17:16, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

You're welcome to. I wouldn't know what to put.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 21:32, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

No i mean i don't know how to make an article separate the creature from the ability do i add something to the name of the article or something?--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:06, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

What do you want to call the creature? The same exact thing as the ability? If so, use lower case for the race. Guardian of ancient kings .

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 22:13, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

You know, it needs something. Like any lore at all.--SWM24 48 22:23, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

That would help too... it's why I never bothered with making a page for them.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 22:25, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Well i originally planned so i could remove a spell(with all it's spells things) from sapient species template, but then i remeber that they haven't shown any proof of being sapient, i still want to the article but there's not much lore either--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:31, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Mountfooter changes

I would like to see a couple of changes to the Mountfooter subpages:

Skeletal Horse mounts - currently Mountfooter/Skeletal lists the category as "skeletal", which is already stretched to include the ebon blade DK mount. It absolutely breaks when you include the raptor. There are too many Skeletal Horses specifically to break that category that way. I would see them moved to Unique for now.
I would see all the sub-page mount links re-jiggered to remove the icons. The icons are only useful if there's a distinct difference, and for the most part there isn't one.

Rather than ask forgiveness, I thought I would ask your opinion on them first. --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 19:32, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Sounds like a good idea.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 21:31, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Just telling the opinion, 'cuz i'm editing mount pages a bit nowadays and i agree that fossilized raptor and dk mount need to be put in some other category, but i'm not sure that it's needed to get rid of icons. Drdead (talk) 23:38, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Template:azeroth aliens

In a fit nonsensical incoherence caused by a admin, i changed the name to a extensive "enciclopedical" name i want to change it back but the thing doesn't let me, can you help?Template:Sapient species alien to Azeroth to Template:Azeroth aliens--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:09, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Done.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 22:17, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Thanks--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:22, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Template:Alliance Sidebar

Hey there Coobra, i'm trying to keep the pages clean and up to date, i just see Gabrirt post anything on side bars thinking anyone can be on there without a reason or role they have to be up and just throws up anything in the Alliance up there, Hope you understand im doing the edits for the good of the pages and everyone. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by ArbiterX122591 (talk · contr).

Just for the record i removed the titles from the leaders because:

A)They're bloating the template

B)They're unnecessary since you can click on the link and see their title

--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:40, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Someone removed all the race icons from the alliance page before you protected it... could you add them back?--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:01, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

(Inserting) To what icons are you referring? The infobox is full of them.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 00:33, 22 January 2011 (UTC)

And substitute this

The children of Cenarius, work closely with the night elves throughout Kalimdor.
- Some Frost nymphs of Stars' Rest
  - Some Frost nymphs are within the Alliance, the most notable is Sarendryana.

For

The children of Cenarius, work closely with the night elves.

That's it if you can--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:05, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Ashbear160 i love how you really fixed up the side bars and made them stand out :) Hope you got some more great ideas and continue to protect the page like me, Admins can't be everywhere up to us to keep them clean for them.--ArbiterX122591 (talk) 23:05, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Thanks--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:14, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Quite the hypocrite since you reverted the same type of edit. --g0urra[T҂C] 00:44, 22 January 2011 (UTC)

I personally think the Admins, should lock the Alliance & Horde Pages and have someone in the adminstration, play around with those posts and have pple submit info, so there is only accurate information. Spam or inaccruate is turned away —The preceding unsigned comment was added by ArbiterX122591 (talk · contr).

If I had the time, I would... but I don't so I won't. The article has gotten out of hand, and I tried to help repair before, but I can't monitor it daily and protecting the page forever is against the spirit of the wiki.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 00:33, 22 January 2011 (UTC)

As much as I hate to be the bad guy, I banned Ashbear160 for three days. This was getting out of hand.--SWM24 48 00:36, 22 January 2011 (UTC)

I'm not arguing or anything, but my point of view never thought Ashbear160 was doing anything wrong, he seemed to always make the Sidebar look more clean, standout and look alot better. I think Gabrirt should get a major ban for the Alliance and Horde Pages cause he seemed to always just throw anything on the page and so many people including Coobra and myself had to reapir what he did and he continued over and over. and should i get a Minior or Major Ban whatever you choose, cause were i have always un-done his posts everytime i seem he had edited and thats against the rules of the Wiki, but did for the good of the page. We are the only two who seem to fight and argue over stuff on the page and we didnt recieve any bans and most of problem was infact us .. so i will leave it to you Admins on your decisions. comment was added by ArbiterX122591 (talk · contr).

Digsite Map template

So... What is your plan for a) zones with more than one digsite in them? b) zones with overlapping digsites? With {{Digsite Map}} you've kinda put an end to any further digsite maps I'd put up. --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 23:29, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

Yea, I been slowly taking images of the maps with digsites and merging them together so only 1 map image with highlights would be needed. Then with that template each spot can be pointed to and placed on the zone article. It's slow going cause I haven't been focused on the profession. Once I get a complete zone with several digsite, the example will look better.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 23:33, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

If you are merging maps to get useful composites, would it help if I sent you my maps? (The which, I need point out, I carefully made while having but one dig site live per map...) I put cropped versions up as the "digsite map.jpg" files. Hmm... If you're making composites, you can probably just use relevant segments from the images I uploaded. --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 00:40, 5 February 2011 (UTC)

I still have doubts about the utility of the project on zones that have overlapping dig sites (Dire Maul and Isilden (feralas), Auchindon (Nagrand), Ruins of Thaurissan (Burning Steppes)). --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 00:42, 5 February 2011 (UTC)

I thought about using your images to speed this along, but decided that would be probably just make it more difficult, since not only would have to match them up perfectly, but also might have to resize them to fit the resolution I use. I've found it just easier to take all the screenshots collected when I get the random digsite and merge the images with a couple of clicks and points. Though I might just try anyway since my randomness of digsites is constantly sending me to Felwood...

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 00:50, 5 February 2011 (UTC)

I may well have documented all of some zones' digsites individually, I do not know. If I have, you could ask for a full screenshot for calibration purposes. Would save you creating them all anew in that limited case. And ... you have much better image editing tools than I do. --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 01:01, 5 February 2011 (UTC)

Question page and a petty thing

Can i create a question page based on this thread http://www.scrollsoflore.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8471, just to see if i can gather a larger number of questions on this page? if i can, can you just give the name you think it's best?

The petty thing is that i cannot remove the spaces between leaders and races in the infoboxes of the horde and the alliance, it wouldn't be a problem if it was in all of them, the problem is that some have spaces and other do not --Ashbear160 (talk) 01:01, 25 January 2011 (UTC)

If you want, I think Scrolls of Lore is doing a pretty good job at it. I would make a forum post, under Warcraft Lore, rather than make an article... as for the name Dev Lore Questions would work fine. As for the infobox issue... don't think there is much you can do about that.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 02:11, 25 January 2011 (UTC)

I would prefer if it wasn't a forum page, because i want people to improve each other questions if possible, add points to the question or just rephrase it better--Ashbear160 (talk) 02:33, 25 January 2011 (UTC)

Would probably get more attention if on the forum, than a randomly named article.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 02:48, 25 January 2011 (UTC)

It's just that in the forum, we can't change each other questions to improve them, in a article we can, and also to divide the discussion from the actual questions would be useful too--Ashbear160 (talk) 03:02, 25 January 2011 (UTC)

Well i don't have time to set it up now that the round 2 started :P, anyway is there any page that has the Dev Lore answers saved and if not can i create one?--Ashbear160 (talk) 02:04, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

Ask CDev.--SWM24 48 02:16, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

Thanks I guess we'll put round 2 below?--Ashbear160 (talk) 02:35, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

User:Ashbear160/CDev Questions Here's the example i just need to find a way to do a format and i think it's good enough--Ashbear160 (talk) 00:39, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

I don't think the format is very good but i have no further ideas, anyway what do you think, and can i turn it into a project page(i figured a project page would be a better page for a page with rules)?i also posted one question as a example of the format--Ashbear160 (talk) 00:57, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

I had a few ideas for this the other night, but forgot to write it down... I'll take a look at your example and get back to you in a bit.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 01:21, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

Err... so what do you think?--Ashbear160 (talk) 12:41, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

It's a good start, but I'm thinking about more details and adding a rating system as well. More on this later though.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 07:33, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Hmm how would a rating system work?--Ashbear160 (talk) 13:11, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

A vote under every question? I personally do not like arbitrary rules unless absolutely necessary.--SWM24 48 17:33, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Yes i know it's with votes but i'm asking about the specific code--Ashbear160 (talk) 20:48, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

{{Vote}}? Though I do not see why someone could not just ask them all in the presumed next round.--SWM24 48 20:53, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Well in scrolls of lore it was done because some people prefer only to post the most popular questions

No matter... it's not a voting system, simply a way to see how many users/players have a strong desire to know. I believe I have finished the layout for it, see User:Coobra/CDev questions. However, I'm undecided on which route to go with for the stars...

Template:Rating/doc - Displays 5 full silver stars before switching to gold.
Template:Rating/dev/doc - Starts with one star from gray to gold, before going to star number 2.

Number 2 will allow for easy expansion should more than 20 like the question, but I'm not sure if the style of it is that great. Sssssssssssssssssssssssss For Pony! (^Sssss/_Slithered) 22:58, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

You're good just one comment, you should add a Object sub-section While there are little questions in the scrolls of lore thread, it needs to be separated from Other--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:33, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Also this part should be added this bit of info

"Warcraft community to the Creative developers,"

Thanks--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:44, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

I prefer Template:Rating/doc

--Ashbear160

I prefer Template:Rating/doc too

Loremaster A'noob, Arch Druid of the Noobhoof Clan (^talk/_contribz) 07:36, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

Very well, that was my first choice as well.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 22:26, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

When we can start adding questions?--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:21, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

It has been moved, feel free to.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 22:26, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

I see questions there that have already been asked in Ask CDev round two. Why is this?--SWM24 48 01:03, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

They weren't answered yet? only when the questions gets answered is when they are removed, that's what's stated in the removing guidelines, also could anyone that has a wow account point people in the story forums to this article plz?--Ashbear160 (talk) 01:06, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

If Blizzard's CDev team is feeling strangely generous, then it may become necessary to overhaul the article to avoid redundancy with answers that we will have gotten. All unanswered questions could be copied at a later date, as Blizzard did not delete the questions from last time immediately, they just un-stickied them. I could post a link to it on the Story Forums, if someone else does not do it first. I still think that it is a bit early.--SWM24 48 01:13, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

Last time it took a month this time i think it will take longer (more questions and all that shazz), besides i'm not adding the entire gigantic list i made on scrolls of lore, just those that interest me, just adding a little clutter so the article doesn't look so nude, i also think i'm doing this a bit too early but there are already people doing round 3 pratice runs (at least one guy stated to be doing that.)--Ashbear160 (talk) 01:23, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

Only posting your questions seems selfish. Also, clutter for the sake of clutter is stupid. I suppose I should post it on the Forum, if no one else has... unless it really is Rag's line. I may regret asking this, but why are there practice runs?--SWM24 48 01:28, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

I don't only post my questions, i post other questions the reason i post lots of mine is because, i was originally interested in them so i saved them, some of them i'm still interested, and i post them, some of them i'm not and i don't post them, also it's not just clutter for clutter sake, i'm genuinely interested in them.

why there are practice runs, i don't know, maybe to help people to not post stupid questions, it seems to be motivated by Omgdruid

also Rag's line? i don't get it?--Ashbear160 (talk) 01:37, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

I took "i'm not adding the entire gigantic list i made on scrolls of lore, just those that interest me" as only posting questions that you have. If other people on Scrolls of Lore have other questions, then they should be saved too. If I misinterpreted, then I am sorry. I do not know about any "practice runs" but I will still post it anyway. "Rag's line" refers to Ragnaros yelling "TOO SOON!" It was a meme before there were mountains to remember people from! I dislike explaining jokes. EDIT: There I posted it (unless Blizzard takes it down). Now stop bugging me. EDIT (again): Hmmm... Omgdruid says that you stole his idea... what am I to make of that?--SWM24 48 04:56, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

Lol if you want you can tell him that i had have a dev lore question thread on the scrolls of lore forums since 07-04-2010, 01:11 AM, http://www.scrollsoflore.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7066&highlight=lore+questions, lol...

At that moment i wasn't posting many questions, just some to fill the thread a little--Ashbear160 (talk) 12:03, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

Metzen Possibly answered questions

No confirmations really, but if it's fake it's a VERY GOOD faker--Ashbear160 (talk) 16:40, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

http://4chanarchive.org/brchive/dspl_thread.php5?thread_id=84793174 (NSFW)

Besides an old forum post and a 4chan thread that you have to be logged in to see, I think that you mean this.--SWM24 48 16:52, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

Tell me why, exactly, we're giving any credence whatsoever to something posted on 4chan? -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 18:26, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

Who is "we"?--SWM24 48 18:34, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

Yes you're link is much better, DTZ the point is that it's either metzen, or a very good impersonator, the emphasis on "Very good"--Ashbear160 (talk) 19:46, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

And given the source, I find the likelihood of it actually being Metzen to be infinitesimally small. It's not difficult for a good writer to impersonate someone in text. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 20:14, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

It's still doesn't stop it from being very very good, i don't think this is metzen, but the probability is not infinitesimally small, or improbable--Ashbear160 (talk) 20:43, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

*shrug* Believe what you will, then. Ultimately, what matters is that 4chan isn't a trustworthy source, so none of it is going on Wowpedia. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 20:50, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

Never suggested that, probably going to archive it somewhere with my username tag--Ashbear160 (talk) 21:16, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

I was bored User:Ashbear160/Archive--Ashbear160 (talk) 21:05, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

Gilneas Gallery

It will take me more time to upload all the small versions.Please do not delete all the ones I didn't reupload yet if I didn't finish till Sunday(Tommorow). Aesindor, The Celestial Paladin (Leave a Message) 19:44, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

At long last,my great gilneas gallery is finished!!!!

Aesindor, The Celestial Paladin (Leave a Message) 23:02, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

Photo Issue

I'm having a problem with the file Aesindor.jpg,think you can help me? Aesindor, The Celestial Paladin (Leave a Message) 13:47, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

I'm guessing the issue was resolved, since the file does not exist.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 22:14, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

Old maps?

While editing some articles I thought of how it would be nifty to use old world maps to compare old and new content. However, I can't seem to find them. Are they removed, or are their names just changed? WrathOfDeathfrost (talk) 14:52, 3 February 2011 (UTC)

They were renamed. I believe -old was added to them, for the most part. You may wish to see Cataclysm map comparison.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 00:44, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

This is exactly what I was looking for! Thanks! WrathOfDeathfrost (talk) 13:11, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

Name

I would like to return to Hallowseve15, Coobra. Hallowseve15 (talk) 21:20, 10 February 2011 (UTC)

Icons

How do you make the icons? is there any sort of turtorial or programs i need because i tried with wowhead and paint and the reults weren't good--Ashbear160 (talk) 19:58, 13 February 2011 (UTC)

I'd prefer the icon making just stay with a very few amount of users. Just so the quality and characteristics match between them. Not saying you'd be bad at making them or anything, but it just seems when ever a user (other than var or me) uploads an icon, one of us has to come in and clean it up.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 01:58, 14 February 2011 (UTC)

Ok managed to put the wmv working let me see if i can put it in photoshop and hit the correct sizes...--Ashbear160 (talk) 19:25, 15 February 2011 (UTC)

Now i'm having problems with photoshop...--Ashbear160 (talk) 21:40, 15 February 2011 (UTC)

Photoshop can be fun, if not annoying sometimes. =P

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 21:42, 15 February 2011 (UTC)

Not that kind of problem... it's more it requesting me for a serial number when it's supposed to be a trial(gosh i hope they weren't hoping of paying up for a trial), where did you get your photoshop?(or you rather not talk about it?)--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:12, 15 February 2011 (UTC)

Do the icons require any photoshop exclusive thing?--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:20, 15 February 2011 (UTC)

Not to my knowledge. And trial's shouldn't need a serial number, supposed to be some sore of trial button or just skip something of the like to get passed that.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 02:52, 16 February 2011 (UTC)

I'll have to use another photoshop-like tool that is free.--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:35, 16 February 2011 (UTC)

Hmm do you screenshot a large image, and make it small or the opposite?--Ashbear160 (talk) 12:32, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

Large to small, too hard to work with small images.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 18:01, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

URGH IT'S HORRIBLE

...

is there anyway to make the image more clear?--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:22, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

Ok fixed the corner thing and the background thing what do you think?--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:32, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

Looks blurry.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 23:45, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

Do you know any specific tool to improve it? or any specific setting? or anything?--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:47, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

Just passing by (nothing mean) but even I you manage to do icons well, if they don't fit to be in the unique list, they will be removed from it ;)

Loremaster A'noob, Arch Druid of the Noobhoof Clan (^talk/_contribz) 23:50, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

Deities get unique icons even if they are not unique, anyway i think the problem is with taking the screenshot from wowmodel viewer with using the correct sizes--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:55, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

I give up for today, first i uploaded with png, it was blurry, not with gif it gives me that it does match the MIME extension--Ashbear160 (talk) 00:12, 18 February 2011 (UTC)

Deities get unique icons even if they are not unique. Who made that rule?

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 05:48, 18 February 2011 (UTC)

The other deities have unique icons, even trough their models aren't any different.--Ashbear160 (talk) 13:25, 18 February 2011 (UTC)

Varghedin told me to use the sharpen tool to remove the blur, and it worked i think? is it still too blurry now?--Ashbear160 (talk) 16:50, 18 February 2011 (UTC)

Vandalism

Btw, Coobra, could you ban a user called Pcj, he deletes articles without reasons, I think it's already third time when he deletes one of the articles I'v made. Yours sincerely, --U7 (talk) 03:17, 14 February 2011 (UTC)

Looking through the deletion logs... he's only deleted one article you created. And that was the one you just made today. Only other things I see deleted are redirects you made and a guild page that did not follow WP:GUILD.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 03:25, 14 February 2011 (UTC)

Okay, well could you do something? Why did he delite article pnagle's test dude? --U7 (talk) 03:26, 14 February 2011 (UTC)

I don't disagree with his actions for that page, and I'm sure had he not deleted it, another admin would have. I'm not sure where you got the image for that, but I'm sure it falls under DNP.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 03:29, 14 February 2011 (UTC)

I don't see how it violates DNP, so could you please revert the deletion. The picture was taken from part of this old screenshort. --U7 (talk) 03:35, 14 February 2011 (UTC)

Because it's from an illegal private server. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 04:09, 14 February 2011 (UTC)

Actually it isn't, the name is in small capitals because the character was just tested in alpha/beta, you can also find the characters ID on DB-MMO, which proves that it has been on real servers . --U7 (talk) 06:36, 14 February 2011 (UTC)

Deities

Moved to Talk:Demigod#Deities

IconSmall Worgen Icons

About [1] and [2], i really don't get why you reverted my uploads. ALL the other playable races IconSmall images ( and [3], and [4], etc) are *exactly* the same, both border and image. Why can't we use the official images for worgens (and goblins) too? Eraclito ( Talk • Edits ) 16:29, 24 February 2011 (UTC)

As I stated in the revert, you should check before blindly changing files.... All racial icons are placed on Wowpedia:List of creature icons. And as with the blood elves and goblins, worgen too have their place. They were reverted because you caused both file locations to be "official" icons, rather than how it was setup.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 22:50, 24 February 2011 (UTC)

Okay, then: why is it the setup? I mean, we have icons matching all the playable races *except* worgen and goblin ones. For them, there're _2.gif like files. Why don't we delete the custom ones and only use the official ones, since they exist?

Anyway, thanks for updating my page :) But wasn't for my user page the reason i 'blindly changed' a custom icon used in templates with the official icon from battle.net. I tried to update something i though was missed by other people (like i recently did for some talents, abilities, other icons). But i feel just discouraged to help, if a change is considered vandalism without even a talk.

Eraclito ( Talk • Edits ) 00:56, 25 February 2011 (UTC)

Don't for discouraged, help is already greatly welcomed. The change you made was never considered vandalism just an overlook of what already existed. I can't speak for everyone, but I find many of the "official icons", especially the worgen ones, not that good. And what it really came down to was that icons that were being used first or the longest took the main name while newer ones took an alternate name. It's just keeping things constant as well and also very easy to switch between them as well:

{{Race|<Worgen>}} Worgen
{{Race|<Worgen (playable)>}} Worgen
{{RaceIcon|<Worgen>|<Male>}}
{{RaceIcon|<Worgen>|<Female>}}
{{RaceIcon|<Worgen2>|<Male>}}
{{RaceIcon|<Worgen2>|<Female>}}

Now... if you want to open a discussion about having the "official icons" moved to the main file name and have the other icons moved to an alternate name (which includes the worgen, blood elves, and goblin), then please open a discussion or maybe even open a vote on which icons would be preferred to have on the main slot. Things are always up for change.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 02:02, 25 February 2011 (UTC)

As for my reason of wanting the "official" icons pushed to the side simply because of their background... every icon we have uses a black background and theirs uses a blue for worgen and red for goblin. It really throws things off.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 02:04, 25 February 2011 (UTC)

4.0.1

How are those pages datamined if the patch is on PTR? I am confused. Hallowseve15 (talk) 02:33, 25 February 2011 (UTC)

It's 4.1.0, and a patch being on the PTR doesn't mean everything being introduced in that patch has been released. If you do not have a source for things, there's nothing I can do. The same goes with your addition to Ragnaros.. MMO-Champion datamines this info and new models, but the new rag has not been seen and that falls under DNP. I believe we've told you this before many times.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 02:48, 25 February 2011 (UTC)

Forsaken History Content lack of BC

history Content lack of BC lore if i recall RAS members had huge role trying find cure for the fel orcs should someone add forsaken role in BC i don't have time do it right now. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Forsakenlord (talk · contr).

K ... ? Random comment is random.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 00:21, 27 February 2011 (UTC)

sorry but i wanted ask could you add forsaken role on History BC content because i am really busy and don't have time to read BC quests.--Forsakenlord (talk) 01:18, 27 February 2011 (UTC)

Seems to be your project.. I have a bunch of stuff I am already doing myself, so I don't have the time to do things for you such as going through all the old BC content.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 01:49, 27 February 2011 (UTC)

Corporeal and Incorporeal Undead

Incorporeal creature
Corporeal creature

Could you help me make those 2 articles? that is if you don't have problems with making them. i also have doubts on the names probably should think off a better one.--Ashbear160 (talk) 20:47, 2 March 2011 (UTC)

Hmm.. it's probably good for a general term, could probably drop creature from it and just make

[Incorporeal] / Corporeal articles.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 01:12, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

It's just to contrast better with the Skeletal creature article that contains rpg data--Ashbear160 (talk) 01:32, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

Also could you tell em what you think of what i've been updating the creature template and the creature articles(Undead and Elemental)--Ashbear160 (talk) 01:47, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

i also found this article that can be used for all Mechanized animal so i added a list there--Ashbear160 (talk) 02:47, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

Could you merge the Rumbling exile and the Rumbling Exile pages?--Ashbear160 (talk) 14:22, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

I dislike such needless classification. Also, why merge the pages? They are not necessarily the same. It could be a type of earth elemental that just shares its name with only one mob. Or, it could be about the mob.--SWM24 48 19:00, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

Which are both earth elementals, it's like saying that Apple pie and Apple Pie aren't the same thing.--Ashbear160 (talk) 20:08, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

No. It is possibly like saying that all murlocs are Murlocs. However, it is very borderline in this case.--SWM24 48 20:12, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

Not to mention that in the section they are said to inhabit Deephome. --g0urra[T҂C] 20:16, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

All earth elementals are from deepholm, they are summoned to azroth you know -.-, and about that SWM this has been done before let me just look for a example --Ashbear160 (talk) 21:06, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

Ok i'm almost giving up, i wanted to make the rpg articles that have little information merged with others with the same information, but it's just a big mess, the Quilboar thornweaver and the Thornweaver article state almost the same, the molten giant article are two one for the background and the other for the mob+background, and a thousand more problems with rpg articles i might as well make a list of problems i see... because... this is leaving me confused...--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:15, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

So nobody has any solutions?--Ashbear160 (talk) 14:55, 13 March 2011 (UTC)

To what, specifically?--SWM24 48 19:20, 13 March 2011 (UTC)

the 2 Molten giant articles is it supposed to be two articles, one about mob+background and another on the background or one mob article and one background article.

Also the thornweaver and quillboar thronweaver should be merged and the goblin tinker(not the unit article) and the tinker article should also be merged.--Ashbear160 (talk) 20:19, 13 March 2011 (UTC)

The two molten giant articles are two articles: Molten giant and Molten Giant. The two thornweaver lore pages should probably be merged, but I am not sure to what name. About the tinkers, not all tinkers are goblins, and goblins are often their own sort of tinker.--SWM24 48 20:30, 13 March 2011 (UTC)

the quillboar thornweaver article should be under Thornweaver races section in the thornweaver article i think.

The Tinker class has a section for Tinker races, and it has only gnome in it, goblin tinker should be put under there.

--Ashbear160 (talk) 20:50, 13 March 2011 (UTC)

Do you have any problems if i merge those two?--Ashbear160 (talk) 13:42, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

Which two? You mentioned more than two pages. The thornweaver pages could be merged, I guess, but I might need to clean the merged page later. I appreciate your enthusiasm.--SWM24 48 19:04, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

I meant merge both the thornweaver with the quilboar thornweaver, and the tinker with goblin tinker.--Ashbear160 (talk) 19:14, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

Merged the articles, i'm going to put the other with a delete tag, and the goblin tinker article contains irrelevant and repeated information which makes me think this information is copied from the source, i didn't pass the languages the quillboar thornweaver speaks because i think that information is irrelevat.--Ashbear160 (talk) 19:22, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

There is nothing wrong with leaving things as redirects. There is nothing wrong with coping information from sources, barring fair use issues, as that means that it is accurate.--SWM24 48 19:31, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

I thought it was wiki standards that useless articles were deleted and that information must not be directly copied unlss stated as such?--Ashbear160 (talk) 19:41, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

What are you interpreting? Cite it.--SWM24 48 19:42, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

i don't know, i just thought it was, anyway you rversed what i did in the thornweaver article :(, and used the quilboar article instead...--Ashbear160 (talk) 19:43, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

I think the Thornweaver article was slightly better written than the quilboar one, also i don't think the language information is relevant--Ashbear160 (talk) 19:47, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

The one who reverted it was me because 1) there's only one type of thornweaver 2) the section was a duplicate of the information that already was in the article. --g0urra[T҂C] 19:48, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

I told you to read our policies and guidelines. Do it. You know you want to. All I did to the quilboar article was remove the delete tag that you put, as it was the wrong one.--SWM24 48 19:55, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

There are too many policies and guidelines, this is the sole reason why i don't bother to read them unless someone points me there, and what i'm saying is that Thornweaver article was slightly better written than the Quillboar thornweaver article.--Ashbear160 (talk) 21:07, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

Admitting that you haven't read the policies is probably not the wisest course of action, and your reasoning is not a good excuse. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 21:11, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

There are like 50 pages of it, i just don't have the patience--Ashbear160 (talk) 21:23, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

Hmm... what do you think, Coobra?--SWM24 48 02:51, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

I'm not sure what the question is... about the mergings? Or about reading the policies/guidelines?

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 03:46, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

Either, though I frown more on the latter. It is your talk page. It is sort of ironic that you are uninvolved.--SWM24 48 04:01, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

Besides the thornweaver articles, I see no reason for the others to be merged... though goblin tinker is a small article, it could be merged into tinker with a redirect. I'll have no issue with that. But a no for the molten giant articles.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 04:10, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

I'm not asking the molten giant articles to be merged, trough one should probably be moved to Molten giant(mob), i had a confusion, because one was supposed to be mob and another background, but the mob article i rmebered it to have lot of background i must have remembered it wrong, the thing with the rumbling exile, is because the background article has very little information that could be merged with the mob article, that's all.--Ashbear160 (talk) 17:19, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

I merged the tinker articles, i don't know how to turn the goblin tinker article into a redirect.--Ashbear160 (talk) 17:23, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

I should've sayed this but what i want is to make RPG information more accessible, it's very hard to find it when most of it, is separated from the rest of the content, when many connections can be made.--Ashbear160 (talk) 18:58, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

There's {{WoW RPG classes}} and {{Warcraft RPG classes}} already, what else do you need? --g0urra[T҂C] 18:59, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

It's not about classes, those two classes were just 2 good examples i found that conventionally had classes, two examples that i also found was Acid bullet and Drill crawler which i linked to the dark iron clan article, just making these articles more accessible or transfer the information to the appropriate place--Ashbear160 (talk) 19:22, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

Is there a category for non-cooking(as in not in the profession) cuisine?--Ashbear160 (talk) 19:40, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

Category:World of Warcraft food items. --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 20:23, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

I don't think i can't put things like Amity wine there can't i...--Ashbear160 (talk) 20:34, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

Items that don't appear in WoW can be placed into Category:Items.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 20:53, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

Thanks that's what i was looking for.--Ashbear160 (talk) 21:09, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

Template:Creature

I updated the creature template and template footers what do you think?--Ashbear160 (talk) 14:55, 13 March 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for fixing those problems :D--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:04, 15 March 2011 (UTC)

Your welcome.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 22:34, 15 March 2011 (UTC)

Now i'm going to try to make a template for every tribe and clan per race.--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:01, 15 March 2011 (UTC)

For some reason i can't edit templates that i already started...--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:12, 15 March 2011 (UTC)

You can, you just had them misnamed under the name parameter.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 00:52, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

I also can't make a broken template because broken is already a tag? which name do i use Broken tribes?

Just use Broken draenei.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 00:54, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

Ok i'll do it tomorrow if nobody else has done it.--Ashbear160 (talk) 00:56, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

Ok i think all types of racial groups are done?--Ashbear160 (talk) 18:51, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

Joren Ironstock

Is there a specific guideline other than the boilerplates that I'm supposed to follow here? I am a new contributer, and I'm just learning all the guidelines. Is there a reason not to include the quest objective in a literate way under the quest header for NPCs? And sorry for the multiple edit updates; I am new, as mentioned, and will get better over time. If there is a problem with the way I'm expanding stubs please let me know, I wouldn't want to anger imposing members of the community who know all about account hacking and whatnot :) Thanks Thewalrus (talk) 07:19, 17 March 2011 (UTC)

Other than our normal Wowpedia:Guidelines, Wowpedia:Policies, and using the boilerplate layout just look to similar articles for examples. Though I would use newer articles for the best examples on how we'd like articles to start appearing, older articles will tend to look as they were wanted years ago. Feel free to experiment in sandboxes as well, these are generally not monitored and allow users to freely try things without interfering with existing articles and preventing edit errors (if another user starts to edit the same article). Welcome to wowpedia. =)

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 05:07, 18 March 2011 (UTC)

Organization

I redid the alliance and horde sections, and changed it for instead of being race by race, to be by jurisdiction or sovereignty, i want to ask your opinion, i'll redo the rest tomorrow.--Ashbear160 (talk) 02:36, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

Images from wowhead

Hello! I was searching images for some NPCs, but I can't find them because they are present only during some events. I found that wowhead has the images, can i upload them or it's forbidden? -- Forco sussura agli abissi 20:37, 24 March 2011 (UTC)

Yes, you can upload those images to Wowpedia. --g0urra[T҂C] 20:38, 24 March 2011 (UTC)

Ok, thanks :) -- Forco sussura agli abissi 20:40, 24 March 2011 (UTC)

Priesthood of elune

Someone joined a lot of priests of elune articles, but then named it Priests and priestesses of Elune, but isn't priesthood of elune a more correct gender neutral name, i tried to change it but it says i can't.--Ashbear160 (talk) 13:57, 27 March 2011 (UTC)

Merging the two is misleading as they are two different terms. --g0urra[T҂C] 14:07, 27 March 2011 (UTC)

Well since vanilla wow the priesthood has been gender neutral amplified by the fact of the two statues in archaeology that tell us that, but i don't really care much of it.--Ashbear160 (talk) 14:11, 27 March 2011 (UTC)

Dragonflight footer

I'm trying to create a dragonflight footer, but i seem to be doing something wrong because i can't get the Red dragonflight to appear on it's page...--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:50, 27 March 2011 (UTC)

I ran out of ideas on how to make this work

nevermind i'm a moron--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:09, 27 March 2011 (UTC)

Racial organization templates

Do you have anymore thoughts on this? I feel it just comes down to what Lon-ami and Ashbear160 want to enforce. Also, do you believe that this is a bit extreme? It has been a pet peeve of mine for a while (pre-Rolandius even) that all mob prefixes and suffixes do not need pages, which may happen, and some people (myself, for now, not included) are not too crazy about navboxes.--SWM24 48 20:05, 30 March 2011 (UTC)

Hmm... it does seem to be getting excessive, cause not everything needs to be in the navbox... but it's like you said in the forum post, things get messy over periods of time.

(^Sssss/_Slithered) 21:04, 30 March 2011 (UTC)

@@ Line 1: / Line 1: @@
+{{:User:Coobra/Header}}
-{{archive|Talk:Sargeras}}
+<!--{| class="plainlinks ambox ambox-red"
-==Major Edits==
+|-
+| class="ambox-image" | [[File:Snake.png|75px]]
+| style="padding: 0.25em 0.5em;" | '''Coobra is currently semi-available due to a few computer ''issues''.'''
+<div class="amsmalltext">
+* Feel free to leave a message, I'll try to answer when I can.
+* <font color=red>If it's important please seek another currently online [[WP:ADMIN|''<font size=2 color=red>Administrator</font>'']].</font>
+</div>
+|}-->
+{| class="plainlinks ambox ambox-green"
+|-
+| class="ambox-image" | [[File:Snake.png|75px]]
+| style="padding: 0.25em 0.5em;" | '''This is a [[Wowpedia:Talk page guidelines|talk page]] for [[User:Coobra|Coobra]]'''
+<div class="amsmalltext">
+* Sorry, Coobra isn't here right now, please leave a message after the beep and I'll respond either here or on your talk page. BEEEEEEP!!!
+* [http://www.wowpedia.org/index.php?title=User_talk:Coobra&action=edit&section=new<font size=2 color=#408080>''Click here to leave me a comment.''</font>]
+</div>
+|}
+<center><small>Leaving a question/comment in the middle of the page and not at the bottom will be ignored.</small></center>
+[[Image:Pwned1wu.gif|right]]
+:''Past discussions archived to...''
-This article needs huge and I mean huges amounts of work in light of new information... Can I say huge headache? We'll also have to pretty revise much of the [[Burning Legion]] history too[[User:Baggins|Baggins]] 17:38, 10 May 2006 (EDT)
+:* ...[[User talk:Coobra/Archive01]] Archived Nov 2007 to May 2008
+:* ...[[User talk:Coobra/Archive02]] Archived June 2008 to May 2009
+:* ...[[User talk:Coobra/Archive03]] Archived June 2009 to August 2009
+:* ...[[User talk:Coobra/Archive04]] Archived September 2009 to November 2009
+:* ...[[User talk:Coobra/Archive05]] Archived November 2009 to March 2010
+:* ...[[User talk:Coobra/Archive06]] Archived March 2010 to July 2010
+:* ...[[User talk:Coobra/Archive07]] Archived August 2010 to
+{{tocright}}
-our real problem is the new timeline contradiction: Everything but the new material assures us that Sargeras encountered the Eredar ''before'' he Fell. This might mean that Metzen's opted for a complete retcon of the Sargeras timeline. --[[User:Ragestorm|Ragestorm]] 17:56, 10 May 2006 (EDT)
+==Faction Icons==
-There's also the [[Nathrezim]]. It would be a fairly minor tweak to have the Nathrezim be responsible for Sargeras' corruption, and then he approached the Eredar. As it was before, the Eredar corrupted him and them he discovered the Nathrezim.  Of course, this is just speculation.  I have no idea what they have in mind. --[[User:Adonzo|Adonzo]] 18:49, 10 May 2006 (EDT)
+I was wondering if you could make more faction icons like this one {{Alliance}} but for the main enemy faction of the expansion, currently 2 which have defined icons(since i don't know what the heck happened in the Burning crusade), the Scourge and the Twilight Hammer, just those 2--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 00:38, 2 November 2010 (UTC)
+:The Main enemy factions only:
+[[File:Twilights Hammer crest.jpg|50px]] [[File:ScourgeCrest.jpg|50px]]
+...Pictures too big if anybody knows how to make them smaller plz fix it...
+:--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 00:41, 2 November 2010 (UTC)
+::Not exactly sure why they would be needed... only reason Scryers and Aldor got them was because you could align yourself or be hostile with them. Whereas the Scourge and Twilight members would always be hostile, for the most part. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 04:16, 2 November 2010 (UTC)
+::Can you make them? It's annoying having to use neutral icons to represent the big bad factions of the expansion--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 22:55, 17 November 2010 (UTC)
+::If someone will do this not forget the [[Illidari]]... (I never see a standard of the [[Burning Legion]]): [[File:Illibanner.jpg|50px]]
+After if you want to undertand what happened in "WoW: [[TBC]]" see [[War in Outland]]([[User:Gabrirt|Gabrirt]] ([[User talk:Gabrirt|talk]]) 21:10, 29 November 2010 (UTC))
+== Hell you Coobra! ==
-You're right, but that descision rests with Metzen. For now, the Dreadlord will remain untouched! --[[User:Ragestorm|Ragestorm]] 20:15, 10 May 2006 (EDT)
+I and my friend adore you as a diety.
+"lying quietly in awe with my forehead against the floor". <small>—The preceding [[Wowpedia:Signature|unsigned]] comment was added by {{User|Teonod}}.</small>
+:Hmm... time for a sacrificial gnome. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 07:45, 5 December 2010 (UTC)
-Best way is to say something neutral like "demonic" race for all previous eredar refrences however, that would be less of a speculation, and just refrencing the comments as we know them.[[User:Baggins|Baggins]] 20:18, 10 May 2006 (EDT)
+::The coobra-god has spoken. I will make a Gnome and kill him in your name. [[User:Teonod | Teonod]]
-:Logistically, not all Eredar follow any one path.  Therefor, there could have been corrupted Eredar that corrupted Sargeras, and he merely did the same to the rest of the race. --[[User:Gigawolf1|Gigawolf1]] 18:00, 18 May 2006
+== Thousand Needles ==
-The new WoW expansion, Burning Crusade, tell that the eredar race was pacific and good before Sargeras intervention.
+Did you want me to cite sources when adding that information? The revert button is usually reserved for vandals... [[User:Needle in a Haystack|Needle in a Haystack]] ([[User talk:Needle in a Haystack|talk]]) 07:52, 5 December 2010 (UTC)
-The original story is still hosted on the WoW site, it may be prudent to have both the pre-TBC and post-TBC versions up. Especially since the new version is a horrible patch job and contradicts what we know through previous games. Mind you, previous games contradicted each other. [[User:Legather|Legather]] 19:05, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
+:It's an unneeded comment and completely irrelevant. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 07:54, 5 December 2010 (UTC)
+== heirloom shouder chants ==
-(::takes note of the "be respectful" note at the top of the page, and heaves a deep sigh::) I'm sure I can't be the only one for whom this is *still* a sensitive issue. Without beating around the bush: Metzen screwed up, he admitted as much, and the "new lore" is now a legitimized mistake (ostensibly retained to avoid having to scrap yet another cheesey Warcraft novel). Just how many ancient, immortal, all-knowing, mystical races does the world of Warcraft need? The storyline is so broken it pains me sometimes. And to think, it all could have been avoided with a little fact-checking!... Or even a Pandaren or two! Or maybe the real-deal Frozen Throne Draenei, before the high-fallutin' space demon connection got dreamed up. Honestly, I don't know how you guys who maintain the pages of WoW Wiki are going to survive with Metzen at the helm of the Lore-ship. In the next expansion (after the one where we go to Northrend, of course) we'll find out all about the Naga's ancient, noble shamanistic heritage, how Sargeras encountered them in the Twisting Nether and corrupted them, turning them into fish-people, and there'll be a novel about it, and their race capital will be on a crashed submarine on a new island zone just off the coast from Stranglethorn Vale, and they'll be opposed to the new Alliance race (Goblins!) who are capturing members of their race and turning them into sushi to help level their cooking profession. --[[User:Shpantzen|Shpantzen]] 05:59, 13 November 2007 (UTC)
-:Bitter much? -- [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] 06:21, 13 November 2007 (UTC)
+can also use aldor/scryer chants on heirloom shoulders <small>—The preceding [[Wowpedia:Signature|unsigned]] comment was added by {{User|Doug105}}.</small>
-Well surprisingly not only is the old story up on the website but you can also find it in-game as well in the in-game books.[[User:Baggins|Baggins]] 06:30, 13 November 2007 (UTC)
+:No clue, probably not. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 21:30, 6 December 2010 (UTC)
+== Quick question, sorry to bother you. ==
-::You do realize that the Naga are corrupted night elves, right?--[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 14:52, 13 November 2007 (UTC)
+Would you mind me using your charcter page for your Night Elf Hunter as a template for my own character in game, I'm not a RPer but I like creative writing and would like permission to both use the page as a template and the permission to add the page in general.
-:::You do realize that Sargeras was a Titan who was in charge of defending Azeroth from the Eredar in the Lore, right? --[[User:Shpantzen|Shpantzen]] 06:20, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
+Many thanks {{user|Extractum}}--Paladin-General of Stormwind 11:41, 6 December 2010 (UTC)
-::::What lore are you reading? Prior to the Draenei retcon, Sargeras was the Champion of the Pantheon who defended ''all'' worlds in the Nether from the Eredar and the Nathrezim, while Azeroth was under the dominion of the Old Gods. After the retcon, Sargeras was the Champion of the Pantheon who defended ''all'' worlds in the Nether from the Nathrezim and other demons, while Azeroth was under the dominion of the Old Gods. The Titans didn't get there until after his fall, Eredar or no eredar.
+:I don't mind. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 21:31, 6 December 2010 (UTC)
-::::You don't like the retcons, tough. We don't give a damn about your opinion, however annoying we find these retcons ourselves. This is en encyclopedia, not a forum. So, either you stop whining and do something constructive around here, or you leave us to our work. Your choice. --[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 14:04, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
+== Frontal view ==
-:::::(looks up at the top of the page at the "be polite" and "be welcoming" guidelines...) Actually, *this* is a talk page. Which is, essentially, a forum. I haven't vandalized any of the pages, taken down anything that didn't jive with my rather strong opinion, nor have I "whined." I've talked. On a talk page. If I have somehow done something wrong, improper or against some unspoken rule of etiquette here? I apologize. If I somehow managed to say something in the two contributions I've made to a single talk page that offended you and managed to earn your rather rude and abbrasive response, then I apologize. But if this is how you're going to treat people who come to here -- to a website essentially devoted to Lore -- to discuss how they feel about the Lore?... well, you might consider [[WoWWiki:Please_do_not_bite_the_newcomers|updating]] your posting guidelines, Mr. Laird o' the Admin. --[[User:Shpantzen|Shpantzen]] 04:41, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
-::::::'''This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Sargeras article.''' Not about the article itself. If you would like to begin such a page, please do so at [[Talk:Sargeras/Analysis]]. Essentially, Rage usually deals with people who aren't appreciative of the lore in any case, and so he's become a bit edgy when dealing with such people. Yes, you did violate a "rule;" no, Rage probably shouldn't have bitten your head off. Also, we absolutely abhor speculation, which is, apparently, what sparked this episode of edits. I personally dislike (even after it being speculation) how you went about speculating, but that's opinion. We already knew Metzen screwed up. --[[User:Sky2042|<span title="WoWWiki Editor">Sky</span>]] <span style="font-size: 85%">([[User talk:Sky2042|talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Sky2042|con]] | <span class="plainlinks">[http://www.wowhead.com/?user=Skyfire wh]</span>)</span> 04:51, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
+Hello! I've seen the better image requests. I can take another one for [[:File:Sergeant Houser.jpg‎|Sergeant Houser]] without problems, but [[:File:Alyssa Blaye.jpg‎|Alyssa Blaye]] and [[:File:Travist Bosk.jpg‎|Travist Bosk]] (as well as [[:File:Eldin Partridge.jpg‎|Eldin Partridge]]) are close facing the practice dummies, and I think it will be difficult to obtain a better image. Anyhow, I'll try. Bye :) --[[User:Forco|Forco]] ([[User talk:Forco|talk]]) 11:49, 7 December 2010 (UTC)
-:::::: I think what angered rage the most was your initial post seemed to have little point other than to complain. This isn't a forum. Metzen screwed up, he's human and it happens. The job we have here to to update the articles accordingly to the most recently published lore. Often there is wiggle room and decisions have to be made to make sense of contradicting sources. This wasn't one of those times. New lore replaced old lore and that's all there is to it. Doesnt mean it was alright for Rage to chew you out, not a good thing to scare off possible future contributers, but you did violate one of the rules. The wiki is a place to share and search for information, not vent our complaints unless its for the sake of an articles improvement.[[User:Warthok|Warthok]] 06:19, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
+:Ah, I knew there had to be reason. If you can get better shots, thank you, if it's not possible go ahead and remove the cleanup tag and state in the edit summary something like, "not possible". {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 07:53, 8 December 2010 (UTC)
+::Done for Sergeant Houser; in the file page I still see the old image, while in the NPC's page I see the new one, and I don't understand why. For the other three, I think that's the better I can do. <small>—The preceding [[Wowpedia:Signature|unsigned]] comment was added by {{User|Forco}}.</small>
+:::It does that occasionally. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 16:24, 10 December 2010 (UTC)
+== Categories ==
-:::::::My overall rudeness and near-violation of TP guidelines is well-documented, and as always, I rely on people like Sky and Warthok to forcefeed me a chill pill. --[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 22:37, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
+Hello! I have just a question: after the removal of many characters from wow, from their pages have been removed all the categories, like [http://www.wowpedia.org/index.php?title=Duke_Hydraxis&action=historysubmit&diff=2547009&oldid=2524389 in this case]. I have a doubt: in the case of Hydraxis have been removed  the quest givers category (and that's fine, because he gives no more quests), the azshara NPCs category (also correct, he's no more present in azshara) and also the water elementals category. This one left me puzzled, because he's ''still'' a water elemental, even if he's no more present in-game. It would be like removing, for example, [[Oakwidow]] from the night elf category because she's not present in-game, or not? The same with [http://www.wowpedia.org/index.php?title=User_talk:Coobra&action=edit&section=new Bale], and so on... --[[User:Forco|Forco]] ([[User talk:Forco|talk]]) 16:18, 13 December 2010 (UTC)
-while this discussion is a year old and i have no place in the discussions of the truely hardcore wowwikites, myself being a simple WoW fan, but here goes: reading your comments gave me a idea, "Metzen screwed up, he's human and it happens." Human? MABYE HE WAS CORRUPTED bY SARGERAS?--Truckman1 23:10, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
+:I will refer you to [[Forum:NPCs removed from game]]. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 22:19, 13 December 2010 (UTC)
+::Mmm, ok. It doesn't convince me, but it doesn't matter. If the decision was that one, for me it's fine. Thanks :) --[[User:Forco|Forco]] ([[User talk:Forco|talk]]) 23:07, 13 December 2010 (UTC)
+== Image problems ==
-:I think we refer to ourselves as "WoWWikians," and you are correct. --[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 13:43, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
+I tried to update a photo and for some reason i ended up with the older version and not the new one. [[User:Gamerd|The Alchemic Warrior of Travels]] ([[User talk:Gamerd|talk]]) 22:34, 13 December 2010 (UTC)
-==Some personal thoughts on how things could fit==
+:That happens occasionally. It will fix itself in time. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 22:48, 13 December 2010 (UTC)
+::Ok. Well anyways. I was putting some updated photos and seen that before. [[User:Gamerd|The Alchemic Warrior of Travels]] ([[User talk:Gamerd|talk]]) 22:52, 13 December 2010 (UTC)
+==Ironforge Airport map==
-In the original story(let me begin a bit of a paraphrase directly from the manual) when he was good, he encountered two demonic races he was forced to fight against. Now originally this was Eredar and Nathrezim.
+You tagged [[:File:Ironforge-Airport.jpg]] as being a policy violation, but left no explanation that I could find. What is the problem? —[[User:MJBurrage|MJBurrage]]<sup>([[User talk:MJBurrage|T]]•[[Special:Contributions/MJBurrage|C]])</sup> 18:29, 15 December 2010 (UTC)
+:While I know the place is easily accessible by flying mount and a specific flight path, I believe that detailing the path that players can take that involved exploiting the world environment is still against our policy. That is why it's marked as a possible violation and not just deleted. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 23:06, 15 December 2010 (UTC)
-Now we know he couldn't have run into the Eredar.
+:: How is it an exploit if anyone can walk the path shown? No add-ons, macros, etc. are required, just jumping over obstacles. —[[User:MJBurrage|MJBurrage]]<sup>([[User talk:MJBurrage|T]]•[[Special:Contributions/MJBurrage|C]])</sup> 23:18, 15 December 2010 (UTC)
-So Let's say it was some other as of yet named demonic race. It was fighting against this certain race, that troubled him. He tried to trap this race in a vacuous corner of the twisting nether.
+::: To even start the path one would have to exploit the starting point.... the rest of it may require no effort, but the beginning does. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 23:21, 15 December 2010 (UTC)
-Then the Nathrezim show up to cause trouble. He fights them. But their darkness was too much for him so became insane, wanting to cause disorder to the universe to undo the titan's works.
+:::: How is jumping forward, and then jumping forward again from where you landed an exploit? —[[User:MJBurrage|MJBurrage]]<sup>([[User talk:MJBurrage|T]]•[[Special:Contributions/MJBurrage|C]])</sup> 23:23, 15 December 2010 (UTC)
-In his madness he shattered the prisons he had made for the unamed race, and nethrezim setting the demons free. Thus the two races offer themselves before him to serve in any malicious way they could.
+::::: It was an exploit prior to the cataclysm and an exploit now. I'm not going to argue about this. Nothing has changed. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 23:27, 15 December 2010 (UTC)
-Let's pause for a minute to insert the new lore;
+:::::: I am not trying to be argumentative, I really don't see how it is an exploit.  Did Blizzard state this was an exploit? How is it any different than getting to [[Foggy MacKreel]]? —[[User:MJBurrage|MJBurrage]]<sup>([[User talk:MJBurrage|T]]•[[Special:Contributions/MJBurrage|C]])</sup> 23:30, 15 December 2010 (UTC)
+::::::: Cause he was intended to get to. Jumping down and climbing a mountain are two different things. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 23:32, 15 December 2010 (UTC)
-Next he heads to Argus to convince the Eredar a benevolent magical culture to join his cause. Those that accept are given more power and are warped into colossal beings. A faction of Eredar seeing what their brothers are becoming but don't want to to be corrupted, get help from Naaru and flee accross the galaxy.
+:::::::: Where does it say that jumping in the mountains is considered an exploit? (real question, again not trying to be argumentative) —[[User:MJBurrage|MJBurrage]]<sup>([[User talk:MJBurrage|T]]•[[Special:Contributions/MJBurrage|C]])</sup> 23:36, 15 December 2010 (UTC)
+== Unused files ==
-So back to the paraphrase of the Warcraft 3 manual.
+Since you seem to be the person who handles this most, please let me know and my apologies if there are any I left behind. Maybe some day I will be experienced enough and seek admin rights so I can clean up after myself. (Or I could just not be so messy in the future.) Thanks. --[[User:Bellocois|Bellocois]] ([[User talk:Bellocois|talk]]) 21:59, 17 December 2010 (UTC)
-So out of the newly acquired and corrupted Eredar he chooses two champions to lead his demonic army of destruction. Kil'Jaeden and Archimonde. He sets Kil'Jaeden to seek out darkest races, and lure them to Sargeras's shadow.
+:No problem, I placed that template just to keep track of the ones that weren't being link to on your page or their own articles. If you do find an image not being used just mark it for speedydelete. =) {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 22:01, 17 December 2010 (UTC)
+== Thank you ==
-He chooses Archimonde to lead his vast armies.
+I've always loved the work of the major contributors and I just want to say "thank you" for helping me clean up the articles I've been adding over the past week.  I've just been snapping screenshots of every NPC I come across and slowly getting around to adding them as time permits.  I always go back and look at the fixes you put in for me and it helps me learn about style and "where stuff goes."  Hopefully, one of these days, I'll have a good enough hang of this that I won't leave you so much work to do.  Anyways, thanks again for your patience and work.   John   [[User:Yithnal|Yithnal]] ([[User talk:Yithnal|talk]]) 16:03, 23 December 2010 (UTC)
-Kil'Jaeden's first move was to enslave the Dreadlords under his dark power. They became his Elite Guard and agents throughout the universe, and they took pleasure in finding primitive races for their master to corrupt and bring into the fold.
+:Happy to help. =) {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 03:32, 27 December 2010 (UTC)
+==Count link==
-First among the dreadlords was Tichondrius and he agreed to promote the sargeras's burning will to all corners of the dark corners of the universe.
+Just pointing out, the Count link on your user page links to the "evil wiki who shall not here be named"
+Have bright sun shining day!
-Archimonde empowered agents of his own, the mighty pitlords and their leader Mannoroth, he hoped to forge a fighting elite that would scour creation of all life.
+{{User:A'noob/sig}} 08:18, 26 December 2010 (UTC)
-Then the legion began its war across the worlds, blah blah blah...
+:heh, forgot about that. Thank you. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 03:31, 27 December 2010 (UTC)
+== How do you do Warcraft 2 screenshots without crosshatching on minimap? ==
+Hi, I saw your [[:File:Beetle_Island.jpg]] (compare to one of my screenshots: [http://img220.imageshack.us/img220/4884/dareregionofthechanneli.png img220.imageshack.us/img220/4884/dareregionofthechanneli.png] and was wondering, how do you do Warcraft 2 screenshots of the minimap without the crosshatching/fine grid put over on the minimap of areas not currently visible to make them darker?
-If you took the time to read my paraphrase I think you'll see that that most of original intent of the story could be salvaged if blizzard made a few slight changes to what was said. The original race that Sargeras fought couldn't be the Eredar, but could be some unknown race we haven't heard about. The nethrezim  could have still come second and been the ones that drove him mad.-[[User:Baggins|Baggins]] 23:22, 10 May 2006 (EDT)
+Even when I use the cheat (press enter type 'showpath' then enter again, that one) it just displays all of the map and stuff that isn't currently being 'seen' by one of your people is greyed out/crosshatched out on the minimap. So not sure how you took that screenshot? Thanks for any info :)
-that's the best idea I've heard since this mess started. We'll need some sort of disclaimer ''(just an italic parenthesis, like this)'' to say that this is an accurate conjecture based on avaliable lore. --[[User:Ragestorm|Ragestorm]] 06:40, 11 May 2006 (EDT)
+Might be good to post the info on the wiki for others so it's common knowledge, especially if you know how to do the same for the other games like Warcraft 1/3 etc! I have only just been trying them out cos I was curious about the background story behind world of warcraft --[[User:Kittymew|Kittymew]] ([[User talk:Kittymew|talk]]) 12:30, 31 December 2010 (UTC)
-:Another possibility is this:  That Sargeras did not fight all of the Eredar (compare with Night Elves, Orcs, and others who were only partially corrupted), but merely a lesser part who had been previously corrupted.  Now, Sargeras would have been troubled by the fact that such wise beings would fall to corruption.  The other possibility is that Sargeras literally purified them,a nd actually removed all taint from them.  In return, this would have entered him.  However, both of these beg the question, 'exactly what corrupted the Eredar the first time?' --[[User:Gigawolf1|Gigawolf1]] 19:03, 18 May 2006
+:It's been a long time since I uploaded that... I don't even know if I copied it from a badly named file or from battle.net. Either way, I didn't personally take the image. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 04:53, 1 January 2011 (UTC)
+== [[Scout Galiaan]] and friends ==
-::"What corrupted the Eredar the first time"? Magic! Power! It could have been that a certain group of Eredar where already corrupted (similar to the Highborne kaldori), that corrupted Sargeras who corrupted the Eredar. Pretty confusing, but believable.:D [[User:Saimdusan|Saimdusan]] 21:31, 14 June 2007 (UTC)
+I had put the Cataclysm shots in separate locations so the old ones would still be accessible. I can see the logic of what you did since the old version is in the file history, but it still seems more logical to have something we can link directly to and say "This is what the character looked like before Cataclysm." Not that the specifics of Named Guard #439's page matter in the long run, but still. --[[User:Bellocois|Bellocois]] ([[User talk:Bellocois|talk]]) 03:20, 2 January 2011 (UTC)
+:If it was a completely new model or completely different look, then I'd say yes, keep an old image to see, but when the only difference is they added a tabard... that's not enough to keep both files. The image history can be viewed if users want to see them without the tabard. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 03:23, 2 January 2011 (UTC)
+While I'm here, you tagged some images for deletion that are linked from my user page as being part of my (extended) to-do list. I ''did'' upload a bunch recently that I didn't create pages for or link to as needing pages, but I plan to remedy that in the next 24 hours or so. --[[User:Bellocois|Bellocois]] ([[User talk:Bellocois|talk]]) 03:32, 2 January 2011 (UTC)
-Well it wasn't just nothing that corrupted the high elves. go read the page about the old gods. it says that the old gods, such as c'thun, all died but 3. excluding c'thun the remaining old gods live inside the planet of azeroth and can "whisper" into the minds of the mortals and their whispers are indecipherable(not sure if thats spelled right) from simply a persons madness. so if theyre the ones that corrupted the high elves, then there have to be other gods such as these on the eredar home planet... so yea... i dont think that they were corrupted at the start i just think that they would be almost the same as the night elves back when they 1st started. no corruption. but then sargeras came and corrupted the ones that he could get his hands on and the ones that resisted were guided away from the planet by the naaru.( light thingys) it says the art about the naaru leading them away on the eredar page...i think.::zaqataq38. january 17, 2007.
+:Oh no no, that is not the speedy delete tag. That is simply an unused image marker. I use it to keep track of images that are currently not being used in articles. It's also another way for users to see if articles are needed, by seeing there's an image in need of an article. I would never delete those. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 03:34, 2 January 2011 (UTC)
+==Your opinion is desired==
-== A disturbing quote from Metzen ==
+Hey, just wanted to get your opinion on [[Talk:Archbishop Benedictus]] about whether or not the "he staged a coup" note from [[patch 1.4.1]] should be considered lore or not. -- [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] ([[User talk:Dark T Zeratul|talk]]) 20:35, 5 January 2011 (UTC)
+Adding my 2 cents. Coobra could you vote in [[Category talk:Patch templates]], regarding the change of icon in Cataclysm Patch templates. I would be very grateful:) {{User:Encaitar/Signature}} 22:17, 5 January 2011 (UTC)
-Not sure where to put it, but it deserves mention:
-"Who dares me to use Old Gods?" - Metzen, regarding possible ''new'' reason for Sargeras' corruption --[[User:Potbasher|Potbasher]] 03:11, 17 May 2006 (EDT)
+== Where are they now? ==
-How disturbed can you get? the only retcons that would require are A) confirming that the [[Pantheon]]  only survived the Old Gods as a unified entity, and that the Old Gods are more than a match for a lone Titan, and B) something saying that the Old Gods are more of a cosmic even than simply the first lords of Azeroth. --[[User:Ragestorm|Ragestorm]] 06:53, 17 May 2006 (EDT)
+Just hit upon the [[User:Coobra/Cataclysm|Where are they now?]] section of your user site, and it's the most comprehensive of its type so far. I've posted [http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/797746-The-MIA-of-Cataclysm my own] [http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1127157453 MIA lists] on the usual forums before, and had been thinking of compiling one myself. In the meantime, I got a response from a GM ticket regarding another MIA character, [[Arko'narin]]. — [[User:Deepred|Deepred]] ([[User talk:Deepred|talk]]) 04:54, 10 January 2011 (UTC)
-I think that comment was meant as a joke, seen as how the Old Gods are responsible for practically everything bad that's ever happened on Azeroth, with the exception of Burning Legion things.  Pinning Sargeras' corruption, and as such the Burning Legion, on the Old Gods would make people's brains explode and he would be murdered within a week.  --[[User:Adonzo|Adonzo]] 01:34, 18 May 2006 (EDT)
+:Oh nice =). Did you get a screenshot of the conversation to be used as a reference in case anyone contests it? {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 05:03, 10 January 2011 (UTC)
-::I think so too, actually, but just thought it should be mentioned somewhere. Because, well, we never know :) --[[User:Potbasher|Potbasher]] 02:14, 18 May 2006 (EDT)
+::Indeed I did. I can upload it on request. — [[User:Deepred|Deepred]] ([[User talk:Deepred|talk]]) 06:13, 10 January 2011 (UTC)
+:::Thank you. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 06:32, 10 January 2011 (UTC)
+You could probably put this in the main space under an appropriate title, whatever that may be. It has the potential to draw significant attention in the way [[Horde bias]] unintentionally did when I created it. Actually, now that I mention that page, it's probably best that you don't move it, let alone let the forums near it. (Kidding. Sort of! :-P) --[[User:Bellocois|Bellocois]] ([[User talk:Bellocois|talk]]) 08:05, 10 January 2011 (UTC)
-If to goes on the page, I insist upon clear disclaimers- I can picture him roaring with laughter after typing that. Though I do like the fact that he admitted he just forgot about the old timeline. --[[User:Ragestorm|Ragestorm]] 06:57, 18 May 2006 (EDT)
+:Heh.. well I started off wanting to do this during the beta... but after getting into finally doing it... I saw that they were still leaving many NPCs out (to be added later) and with the phasing, I wouldn't be able to just fly through zones looking for specific things.. I'd have to quest through the zones. But new toons come after older toons... so eventually I'll get back to this. I'd just prefer to being able to control it on my userspace, rather than letting it run rampant like Horde/Alliance bias =P. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 08:11, 10 January 2011 (UTC)
+== User Templates (?) ==
-Maybe he meant that first he was bothered by the nathrezim race, and then, while fighting the old gods he finally lost his faith in his mission...maybe, like they did to the high elves in tirisfal, the old gods whispered to sargeras and made him mad, since his resolution was made weaker by the encounter with the nathrezim, maybe they wanted him to help them to destroy all
+Not sure if I titled the headline right or not. However I was wondering where I would be able to find more of the {{User Horde}} objects. I've forgotten the URL and haven't been able to find it on WoWPedia --[[User:Alindaloran|Alindaloran]] ([[User talk:Alindaloran|talk]]) 10:52, January 12, 2010
-::That would have to be retconned so that Sargeras actually fought the Old Gods, as the Pantheon fought them short after his fall (recall that only four members blessed the Aspects), but prior to the arrival of the Legion. What high elves in Tirisfal? --[[User:Ragestorm|Ragestorm]] 06:06, 31 August 2006 (EDT)
+:You can look at all "User*" templates [{{fullurl:Special:PrefixIndex|prefix=User&namespace=10}} here] —[[User:Egingell|<span class="ajaxttlink">EGingell</span>]]<sup>[[User_talk:Egingell|T]][[Special:Contributions/Egingell|C]]</sup> {{User:Egingell/Playerlink|Cenarion Circle|Treader|Treader of Cenarion Circle}} 09:28, 13 January 2011 (UTC)
+== Admiral Nightwing ==
-When the High Elves first landed in Lordaeron they build a settlement in Tirisfal, but "something evil beneath the earth" drove many of them mad, so they moved on towards Quel'Thalas  -Rovdyr
+I said in the summary he needed to be renamed to '''Admiral Nightwind'''. [[User:Hallowseve|Hallowseve]] ([[User talk:Hallowseve|talk]]) 13:17, 13 January 2011 (UTC)
-As it stands, the entire plot of Warcraft is a 'disturbing quote from Metzen'. Imagine if Tolkein had turned around and said "Actually, the Ring was happy just sitting on people's fingers until Gollum came along and turned it evil". [[User:Legather|Legather]] 19:15, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
+:Admiral Nightwind already existed, hence it's deletion. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 21:34, 13 January 2011 (UTC)
+==Class thing==
-Wasn't it Kil'jaeden that inslaved the Dreadlords?  But if it was Sargeras, then did Kil'jaeden enslave them after they were weak or what? [[User:Jclipps|Jclipps]] 16:28, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
+::::It has to be consistent with playable races like the [[Night elf|night elves]]. They have the WoW classes at the top.--[[User:Atomos|Atomos]] ([[User talk:Atomos#top|talk]]) 01:08, 14 January 2011 (UTC)
-I might be a bit slow but this is just incredible.. I just told Ragestorm something about lore he didn't know before!! Maybe we should get a new bookkeeper? Just Kidding ofc :P -[[User:Rovdyr|Rovdyr]] 17:16, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
+::And Highborne elves are actually ''playable'' so they should count.--[[User:Atomos|Atomos]] ([[User talk:Atomos|talk]]) 01:12, 14 January 2011 (UTC)
-== The Future ==
+== Tinkering (Engineering) ==
-We've been discussing the past of Sargeras quite a bit but what about the future. We all know that he's pretty much the big bad guy of warcraft. He tops everyone else. And as much as I, and pleny of other people, love the story of Arthas and the Lich King, this guy
-is bigger and badder than that. Right now he's basically dead, or more accuratelly, he's drifting in the nether, but he has to come back. A villain like this doesn't just stay dead, they never do. When WoW ends, and with wow, Warcraft all together, this is the guy to be killed.
+I am moved to mirth...  having had the page I created turned into a redirect, then deleted to make way for the page it was directing to.  I guess I am confirmed in my guess as to the correctness of my choice of name. {{=)}} --[[User:Eirik Ratcatcher|Eirik Ratcatcher]] ([[User talk:Eirik Ratcatcher|talk]]) 22:42, 14 January 2011 (UTC)
-I somewhat doubt that the driving out of his spirit meant his death. I seem to be relying on the LotR references here but look at what happened to Morgoth and Sauron. Upon their defeat, their spirits were 'simply' cast out of the world. [[User:Legather|Legather]] 19:26, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
+:Aye. I didn't realize  Tinkering (Engineering) had also just been made, thought Tinkering (engineering) was a duplicate, but it is the correct name. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 23:40, 14 January 2011 (UTC)
+::Ayup.  Someone ELSE had made Tinkering (Engineering) by the time I came along. And by george, they must have been making it at about the same time I was making mine! --[[User:Eirik Ratcatcher|Eirik Ratcatcher]] ([[User talk:Eirik Ratcatcher|talk]]) 00:54, 15 January 2011 (UTC)
+:::According to the logs, Grynd starting making the page 3hrs or so before you. =P {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 01:38, 15 January 2011 (UTC)
+== Old Mammoth ==
-There's one thing that deserves looking at. The first time Illidan failed killing the Lich King, Kil'Jaeden came to him and threatened him almost instantly. It's been about two years (or four, if years WoW has been live count) since Illidan failed again and Kil'Jaeden has left him pretty much alone. Where is he? Recruiting more soldiers? Or is he looking for, or has he already found Sargeras. Personally, I think Kil'Jaeden would be pretty happy without Sargeras in the picture but I think that's a point worth looking at. Maybe Sargeras even found him. - Maarz Jan 20/07
+Heya, could you possibly move the article "Last Weeks Mammoth" to "Last Week's Mammoth"? I know it's only a minor typo, but I still find it somewhat annoying. WoWpedia might be more "human-made" than WoW-databases such as Wowhead which digs data directly, but it should still be on par with it when it comes to names! Also, if possible, it'd be nifty if you could make "Last Weeks Mammoth" redirect to the new page. [[User:WrathOfDeathfrost|WrathOfDeathfrost]] ([[User talk:WrathOfDeathfrost|talk]]) 22:39, 15 January 2011 (UTC)
-::The whole point of Kil'jaeden is that he's always scheming in the background; we never know what he's up to, and that's far more menacing than getting regular updates.--[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] · [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 23:09, 20 January 2007 (EST)
+== Your opinion is desired ==
-::No doubt, just expressing a thought though, no need to get upset -- Maarz
+Hey Coobra, the [[Alliance-Horde War]] article is constantly changed to include Malfurion as an Alliance commander, while hee actually doesn't take part in the conflict similar to [[Lady Liadrin]], [[Hamuul Runetotem]], [[Varok Saurfang]] or even [[Thrall]] who are not listed. Could you please visit [[Talk:Alliance–Horde War#Malfurion is not an Alliance commander|Talk:Alliance–Horde War]] and discuss. I really think he doesn't fit there, as he is more neutral as leader of Cenarion Circle (just like the 4 Horde commanders who simply do not take part in the war eventhough they're in the Horde). Thanks in advance {{User:Encaitar/Signature}} 20:35, 16 January 2011 (UTC)
-:::Sorry if I came across that way, it was not my intention. --[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] · [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 08:53, 22 January 2007 (EST)
+:Well he's not exactly the neutral leader but the alliance representative of the cenarion circle--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 10:23, 17 January 2011 (UTC)
+==Sapient race templates==
-::"Kael'thas Sunstrider yells: All for what? Trinkets? You are too late. The preparations have already begun. Soon the master will make his return."   Don't you think that this master can be just Sargeras? Isn't he the true master of Burning Legion?So maybe they plans to make him living again([[User:BirdFox|BirdFox]] 19:49, 9 June 2007 (UTC))
+Ugh i'm sorry if i complain too much but it seems gourra doesn't know that the sapient templates are made to fit certain things and he's changing the templates to fit the name of the article, which PCJ named it wrong...--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 01:38, 18 January 2011 (UTC)
+:Sorry for being annoyance, but i really took a long time to arrange the templates--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 01:39, 18 January 2011 (UTC)
+== Forsaken  ==
-:A'dal says Kil' is comeing to Azeroth.--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 19:38, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
-I didn't get why when Gul'Dan came to Sargeras's tomb he couldn't find his body, though it was Sargeras himself who told him where to find him. I read in an article which was claiming that. Even when Illidan came the only thing he found was his eye. So now Sargeras's body is gone and even he doesn't know where it is?--[[User:Grievous|Grievous]] 08:21, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
+Should i change
-==Stupid and Useless Pictures ==
-The first picture of Sargeras is excellent. The second picture I'm pretty sure is not Sargeras but a doom guard. remember he is dead and his spirit is lost in the twisting neither not in the tomb of sargeras. also if you know Gul'dan's story he was torn apart by demons and this was just one of them, he just thought it was Sargeras. next picture in one of a daemon not Sargeras so why the hell is it in the article. [[User:Noman953|Noman953]] 23:28, 23 January
-:Because, I'm willing to bet that the second picture comes from WCII, when Gul'dan opened Sargeras's tomb. Several demons popped up and owned him. I don't know if it is or isn't, but I suspect that's why it was there (hence the description of "Demon from the tomb").--[[User:Sky2042|Sky]] 23:37, 23 January 2007 (EST)
+"Among the tauren the Forsaken found a champion in Magatha Grimtotem, who argued in favor of the alliance between the two peoples and who continues to work closely with them. Magatha claims she merely wants to aid the Forsaken in their quest to redeem themselves, although there are many who believe her true motives to be something very different and much less innocent."
-::I'll take responsibility for the WC2 one still being there, as I changed the caption with the intent of discussing its removal, but never got around to discussing said removal. The WC3 image is up for debate, as it's the image that Gul'dan sees in the distance. He takes it to be Sargeras, and the shadow does ''not'' look like a Doomguard. The best explanation for this is that it's an image conjured by his fevered mind, as he wasn't torn apart until later in the tomb. The WC2 was stupid and useless, but the WC3 one was only one or the other. That one could remain, captioned "Sargeras's ghost as percieved by Gul'dan."--[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] · [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 23:44, 23 January 2007 (EST)
+with newer source:
-== Headings ==
+"The kind-hearted tauren of Thunder Bluff proved to be the most promising contact. Specifically, Archdruid Hamuul Runetotem saw the potential for redemption in Sylvanas’ people, even though he was fully aware of the Forsaken’s sinister nature. Thus, the tauren convinced Warchief Thrall, despite his misgivings, to forge an alliance of convenience between the Forsaken and the Horde."
-I'm wasn't quite sure where to the place the first heading, and the last heading I'm not quite so sure about. Otherwise, are they worthy? {{=)}}--[[User:Sky2042|Sky]] 23:47, 23 January 2007 (EST)
+http://us.battle.net/wow/en/game/race/forsaken
-==Illidan's Runes==
-Anyone know the full story behind the runes on Illidan's body and how and why Sargeras gave them to him. Ragestorm I know you knew something about that. I would like to include it myself but I'm too ignorant about the full story.--[[User:Noman953]] 19:34, 23 January 2007
+Because in Cata  Grimtotem and forsaken Relations made no Reference at all The quests could possibly has been retcon and blizzard website changed it from magtha to Hamuul.--[[User:Forsakenlord|Forsakenlord]] ([[User talk:Forsakenlord|talk]]) 22:42, 20 January 2011 (UTC)
-::"Ignorant" it far too strong a word in this case, Noman. I'm separated from my copy of ''The Sundering'', so I can't replicate the full story. Cliffnotes version: Illidan's eyes are destroyed (either for daring to look at Sargeras or simply removed by him, I can't recall which), and new eyes are granted to him, which can see all forms of magic. The tatoos/scars across his body snaked outward from the new burning eyes, not stopping until he was covered by their macarbe pattern. So horrific were his new eyes that not even Xavius could look into them. Azshara, of course, was undaunted, and found his new enhancements intriguing. Illidan was, as expected, unnerved by her interest. There has been no sign of residual connection to Sargeras in the centuries since.--[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 19:49, 26 January 2007 (EST)
+:Couldn't they both have argued in favor of them... {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 23:08, 20 January 2011 (UTC)
-Don't you mean that Mannoroth was too horrified? Illidan was powered up after Malfurion treeified Xavius, and in any case, Mannoroth would be a better example. I mean if the prime Pitlord is disturbed by them, they must be very unsettling.--[[User:Austin P|Austin P]] 09:22, 22 June 2007 (UTC)
+could be however with shattering magtha never called the forsaken to aid her against [[baine bloodhoof]] instead asking garrosh aid + forsaken info from new website + No Reference made between the forsaken and Grimtotem + Grimtotem never sought the forsaken aid + Grimtotem Allied with Alliance (forsaken hatred enemy)= retcon? --[[User:Forsakenlord|Forsakenlord]] ([[User talk:Forsakenlord|talk]]) 23:23, 20 January 2011 (UTC)
+== Wowpedia/World of Warcraft Acheivements thingy or wutever its called ==
-== Sargeras Dead? ==
+how do you keep those doohickies in a straight column??????[[User:Itsuki624|Itsuki624]] ([[User talk:Itsuki624|talk]]) 06:53, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
-I just finished reading "The Sundering" of the War of the Ancients trilogy. At the end of the book, Sargeras was supposedly destroyed along with the Well of Eternity as they both "ceased to exist". I think this also supports Sargeras' absence during the third war, perhaps he really is dead because Kiljaeden leads the legion. --TheOneCalledRed- February 26,2007
+:Edit my page and copy the code the same way you did before... just take all of it, rather than portions. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 06:55, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
+I was only editing to find out how to make the pictures,I didn't copy it.And how do you do that snake tail thing??PS.how would i make a thingy for preferring the Horde over the Alliance?[[User:Itsuki624|Itsuki624]] ([[User talk:Itsuki624|talk]]) 07:09, 21 January 2011 (UTC)Itsuki624
+Never mind about the signature.I already got that done.[[Image:IconSmall_Unholy_Rune.png]]&nbsp;[[User:Itsuki624|Itsuki624]] ([[USer talk:Itsuki624|talk]] [[Special:Contributions/Itsuki624|contribs]]) 21:57, 24 January 2011 (UTC)Itsuki624
-:Sign your posts properly, please. This is impossible, as Sargeras possessed Medivh during the First War, and was active 800 years beforehand (some 9200 years after the Sundering). --[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 23:21, 26 February 2007 (EST)
+Just 4get it all because I have an even liking of races in the factions.I like 3 of the Horde and 3 from the Alliance[[Image:IconSmall_Unholy_Rune.png]]&nbsp;[[User:Itsuki624|Itsuki624]] ([[USer talk:Itsuki624|talk]] [[Special:Contributions/Itsuki624|contribs]]) 23:50, 26 January 2011 (UTC)Itsuki624
-Oooooo, I forgot all about that. So then Sargeras must be around somewhere, if he is why hasn't he returned as the Lord of the Legion?
---TheOneCalledRed - 9:45 - 27 February 2007.
+In fact,I used those 6 to make my own small faction.I'm making a userbox for it,but im having problems with the pics.[[Image:IconSmall_HighElf_Male.gif‎]]&nbsp;[[User:Itsuki624|Itsuki624]] ([[USer talk:Itsuki624|talk]] [[Special:Contributions/Itsuki624|contribs]] Lord of the Elves) 09:28, 28 January 2011 (UTC)Itsuki624
-:I think Sargeras was serious weakened from his attempt to open a portal through the Twister Nether only to have it collapse on him. Later when Lothar and Khadgar slay Medivh Sargeras his spirit ends up in the Nether (or limbo). He could be dead, but he could still be alive somewhere --[[User:Montronax|Montronax]] 10:27, 27 February 2007 (EST)
+==Guardian of Ancient kings==
-::This is one of the reasons that titans are among the beings whose status is "active." Sargeras would have been back to full strength ''long'' before Aegwynn destroyed his physical body, so whatever weakening happened from the Sundering has no effects on Azeroth (though some other worlds might have been saved).
+Could you make an article for the creature instead of the ability? plz--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 19:20, 17 January 2011 (UTC)
-::Two situations for Kil'jaeden to be Lord of the Legion: 1) Sargeras is completely destroyed or, more likely 2) without a physical body, most demons (who are simple-minded things for the most part) wouldn't follow him, so Kil'jaeden would have to assume command for figurehead purposes (and even with Sargeras at full power, he probably handled a number of day-to-day operations). --[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 10:37, 27 February 2007 (EST)
+:plz?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 17:16, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
+::You're welcome to. I wouldn't know what to put. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 21:32, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
+:::No i mean i don't know how to make an article separate the creature from the ability do i add something to the name of the article or something?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 22:06, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
+::::What do you want to call the creature? The same exact thing as the ability? If so, use lower case for the race. [[Guardian of ancient kings]] .{{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 22:13, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
+:::::You know, it needs something. Like any lore at all.--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 22:23, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
+::::::That would help too... it's why I never bothered with making a page for them. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 22:25, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
+:Well i originally planned so i could remove a spell(with all it's spells things) from sapient species template, but then i remeber that they haven't shown any proof of being sapient, i still want to the article but there's not much lore either--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 22:31, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
+== Mountfooter changes ==
-Sargeras' spirit was cast into the Twisting Nether wasn't it? His spirit is far too powerful to go into any body, and thus has "Ceased to exist". So you could say Sargeras is dead, as a being his power would not fit into WoW, because he would just kill us all if he returned.
---[[User:Going2hell|Going2hell]] 00:58, 12 April 2007 (EDT)
+I would like to see a couple of changes to the Mountfooter subpages:
-Be an interesting instance idea though. Beat the boss in x minutes or he finishes summoning sargeras and he one shots the whole raid. I mean patchwerk and most other raid bosses do a similar trick but being hit by sargeras for 99999999999999999 points of damage would jsut be cool.--[[User:Darkling235|Darkling235]] 13:37, 13 April 2007 (EDT)
+# Skeletal Horse mounts - currently Mountfooter/Skeletal lists the category as "skeletal", which is already stretched to include the ebon blade DK mount.  It absolutely breaks when you include the raptor.  There are too many Skeletal Horses specifically to break that category that way.  I would see them moved to Unique for now.
+# I would see all the sub-page mount links re-jiggered to remove the icons.  The icons are only useful if there's a distinct difference, and for the most part there isn't one.
+Rather than ask forgiveness, I thought I would ask your opinion on them first. --[[User:Eirik Ratcatcher|Eirik Ratcatcher]] ([[User talk:Eirik Ratcatcher|talk]]) 19:32, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
+:Sounds like a good idea. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 21:31, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
+:: Just telling the opinion, 'cuz i'm editing mount pages a bit nowadays and i agree that fossilized raptor and dk mount need to be put in some other category, but i'm not sure that it's needed to get rid of icons. [[User:Drdead|Drdead]] ([[User talk:Drdead|talk]]) 23:38, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
+==Template:azeroth aliens==
-:::There is an interesting idea proposed in the Alliance and Horde Companions that Aegwynn only fought an avatar of Sargeras, and not actually Sargeras himself. That is the avatar was only part of Sargeras will, and not his true being. She was possessed by the avatar, and through the avatar Sargeras could control Medivh. If this has any basis, it might mean that Sargeras might still be out there.[[User:Baggins|Baggins]] 13:45, 13 April 2007 (EDT)
+In a fit nonsensical incoherence caused by a admin, i changed the name to a extensive "enciclopedical" name i want to change it back but the thing doesn't let me, can you help?[[Template:Sapient species alien to Azeroth]] to [[Template:Azeroth aliens]]--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 22:09, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
+:Done. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 22:17, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
+::Thanks--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 22:22, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
-::::This would explain Kil'jaeden's recall from Draenor; he hinted to Mannoroth that Sargeras had ordered him back. --[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 14:44, 14 April 2007 (EDT)
-::Ya, I was thinking about that the other day.[[User:Baggins|Baggins]] 14:45, 14 April 2007 (EDT)
+==Template:Alliance Sidebar==
-:As I understand it, when they said "Sargeras ceased to be" they were referring to the fact that he vanished - not died, vanished. The portal collapsed and so, their view of the [[Sargeras | Fallen Titan]] was cut off. When Aeqwynn defeats Sargeras, she does so a little too easily - a trick by him, so that he could sneak his way into her body and, eventually, into her son. Medivh then became possessed by Sargeras, and when Medivh was killed, Sargeras was "banished to the dark abyss" or something alone those lines... implying that he isn't dead, but that his spirit still roams the universe, regaining strength.
+Hey there Coobra, i'm trying to keep the pages clean and up to date, i just see Gabrirt post anything on side bars thinking anyone can be on there
-:~[[User:Peregrine2976 | Peregrine]]
+without a reason or role they have to be up and just throws up anything in the Alliance up there, Hope you understand im doing the edits for the good
+of the pages and everyone. <small>—The preceding [[Wowpedia:Signature|unsigned]] comment was added by {{User|ArbiterX122591}}.</small>
+:Just for the record i removed the titles from the leaders because:
-::I really don't think he is dead. Something is very fishy about the Aegwynn encounter. During the War of the Ancients, Sargeras was ''almost'' summoned at the very end, after a long time of trying, including several failed attempts and the only way to do it was to use the Well of Eternity itself. But when the demons fought with Aegwynn they were able to summon him in about five minutes with a simple portal, obviously something was wrong.
+::A)They're bloating the template
+::B)They're unnecessary since you can click on the link and see their title
-::My theory's, he created a new, much much weaker body and transfered his spirit into it. While in that body he was weak enough to be summoned into Azeroth. His real body is being kept somewhere. Another theory is that he somehow stripped himself of most of his power enabling himself to be easily summoned, then he forfeited his real body by letting it be destroyed, which seems really stupid for him to do. One point that nobody should forget is that Sargeras at 100% power would be very difficult to summon to Azeroth.
+:--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 22:40, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
+::Someone removed all the race icons from the alliance page before you protected it... could you add them back?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 23:01, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
-::My guess is that after the possed Medivh was killed, the spirit of Sargeras was sent to the nether doing who knows what. Kil'jaeden has been searching for Sargeras' spirit and is preparing to put it back in Sargeras' true body. And maybe he just found the lost spirit.
-::[[User:Nathanmaxtro|Nathanmaxtro]] 02:11, 12 August 2007 (UTC)
+::::(Inserting) To what icons are you referring? The infobox is full of them. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 00:33, 22 January 2011 (UTC)
-:::At the end of RotH, Kil'jaeden tells Mannoroth that "Sargeras hungers, and he has been very patient with me."--[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 02:19, 12 August 2007 (UTC)
+:::And substitute this
-Isnt there a chance that Kil'jaeden doesn't want the Burning legion to find where Sargeras is so he can control the Burning Legion? <small>—The preceding [[WoWWiki:Signature|unsigned]] comment was added by {{User|Ksergey}}.</small>
+*The children of Cenarius, work closely with the night elves throughout Kalimdor.
+** Some Frost nymphs of Stars' Rest
+*** Some Frost nymphs are within the Alliance, the most notable is Sarendryana.
+:::For
+*The children of Cenarius, work closely with the night elves.
+:::That's it if you can--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 23:05, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
+:Ashbear160 i love how you really fixed up the side bars and made them stand out :) Hope you got some more great ideas and continue to protect the page like me, Admins can't be everywhere up to us to keep them clean for them.--[[User:ArbiterX122591|ArbiterX122591]] ([[User talk:ArbiterX122591|talk]]) 23:05, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
-I believe Sargeras is not only going to return, but in his old body as well.(in the tomb of Sargeras his body was nowhere to be found, even though Sargeras himself sent Gul'Dan to look for it. I think it's possible that Sargeras took somehow his body out of there, because he knew Gul'Dan was trying to use his power for his own needs.)And besides, we are talking about the most evil being ever to live.. it can't end like this...--[[User:Grievous|Grievous]] 00:46, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
+::Thanks--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 23:14, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
+::Quite the hypocrite since you [http://www.wowpedia.org/index.php?title=Alliance&diff=2595337&oldid=2595262 reverted the same type of edit]. --{{User:Gourra/Sig2}} 00:44, 22 January 2011 (UTC)
+I personally think the Admins, should lock the Alliance & Horde Pages and have someone in the adminstration, play around with those posts
-Most likely Sargeras' limbo condition is being used to purposely weaken him. When you think about the power that Archimonde exhibited in his battles on Azeroth, it does not seem like such a far fetched idea. Archimonde was highly resistant to all forms of attack, and thus one can assume that Kil'jaeden, his superior would be even more powerful. Point being that if Sargeras at full power was ever to set foot on Azeroth he would be damn near invincible against the mortal races. So to give the races of Azeroth a chance to rid themselves of the legion his limbo status was introduced. He likely still communicates and gives orders to Kil'jaeden but he is most probably in a very weakened state. Perhaps with the release of the Sunwell Plateau raid (WoW's patch 2.4) and the inevitable battle against Kil'jaeden we may learn the key to destroying Sargeras. Either way these characters must die one way or another, the fates of  Azeroth and the Legion are intertwined one will survive one will cease to be. Archimonde's death is proof that Kil'jaeden can die, which is proof that Sargeras can die...this "limbo" state is a way of making that fact realistic. --[[User:Ruffa1|Ruffa1]] 08:50, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
+and have pple submit info, so there is only accurate information. Spam or inaccruate is turned away <small>—The preceding [[Wowpedia:Signature|unsigned]] comment was added by {{User|ArbiterX122591}}.</small>
-(Sorry if I'm a little off-topic). Personally, I hope that Sargeras never appears in World of Warcraft. Or at least isn't killable. His death would most likely result in the end of Warcraft, unless Blizzard has some new character planned. [[User:Zentyr|Zentyr]] 00:50, 19 January 2008 (UTC)
+:If I had the time, I would... but I don't so I won't. The article has gotten out of hand, and I tried to help repair before, but I can't monitor it daily and protecting the page forever is against the spirit of the wiki. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 00:33, 22 January 2011 (UTC)
+As much as I hate to be the bad guy, I banned Ashbear160 for three days. This was getting out of hand.--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 00:36, 22 January 2011 (UTC)
-== Sargeras in WoW ==
+I'm not arguing or anything, but my point of view never thought Ashbear160 was doing anything wrong, he seemed to always make the Sidebar look
-This recently occured to me, if i'm reading this article corrently, Sargeras possessed Medivh, if that is true, couldn't it be said that in the Caverns of Time instance where we protect Medich, we are in a sense, protecting Sargeras who has gained control over Medivh's body? [[User:Hordesupporter|Hordesupporter]] 23:51, 26 March 2007 (EDT)
+more clean, standout and look alot better. I think Gabrirt should get a major ban for the Alliance and Horde Pages cause he seemed to always just throw anything on the page and so many people including Coobra and myself had to reapir what he did and he continued over and over. and should i get a Minior or Major Ban whatever you choose, cause were i have always un-done his posts everytime i seem he had edited and thats against the rules of the Wiki, but did for the good of the page. We are the only two
+who seem to fight and argue over stuff on the page and we didnt recieve any bans and most of problem was infact us .. so i will leave it to you Admins on your decisions.
+comment was added by {{User|ArbiterX122591}}.
+== Digsite Map template ==
-: That's ... true. And crazy. {{User:Kirkburn/Sig2}} 00:45, 27 March 2007 (EDT)
+So... What is your plan for a) zones with more than one digsite in them?  b) zones with overlapping digsites?  With {{t|Digsite Map}} you've kinda put an end to any further digsite maps I'd put up.  --[[User:Eirik Ratcatcher|Eirik Ratcatcher]] ([[User talk:Eirik Ratcatcher|talk]]) 23:29, 24 January 2011 (UTC)
-Yep, we're assisting the burning legion! [[User:Hordesupporter|Hordesupporter]] 01:38, 27 March 2007 (EDT)
+:Yea, I been slowly taking images of the maps with digsites and merging them together so only 1 map image with highlights would be needed. Then with that template each spot can be pointed to and placed on the zone article. It's slow going cause I haven't been focused on the profession. Once I get a complete zone with several digsite, the example will look better. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 23:33, 24 January 2011 (UTC)
+::If you are merging maps to get useful composites, would it help if I sent you my maps?  (The which, I need point out, I carefully made while having but one dig site live per map...) I put cropped versions up as the "digsite map.jpg" files.  Hmm... If you're making composites, you can probably just use relevant segments from the images I uploaded.  --[[User:Eirik Ratcatcher|Eirik Ratcatcher]] ([[User talk:Eirik Ratcatcher|talk]]) 00:40, 5 February 2011 (UTC)
+::I still have doubts about the utility of the project on zones that have overlapping dig sites (Dire Maul and Isilden (feralas), Auchindon (Nagrand), Ruins of Thaurissan (Burning Steppes)). --[[User:Eirik Ratcatcher|Eirik Ratcatcher]] ([[User talk:Eirik Ratcatcher|talk]]) 00:42, 5 February 2011 (UTC)
-::While ensuring they're defeated; if the orcs don't cross into Azeroth, they don't get redeemed, the Alliance isn't formed, and Mannoroth, Tichondrius, Hakkar and Archimonde are still alive. --[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 19:53, 27 March 2007 (EDT)
-:::(Injecting my comment in 4 months later) Rage, I'm shocked! Hakkar died in the War of the Ancients! --[[User:Sky2042|Sky]] ([[User talk:Sky2042|t]] · [[Special:Contributions/Sky2042|c]] · [http://www.wowhead.com/?user=Skyfire w]) 04:56, 12 August 2007 (UTC)
+:::I thought about using your images to speed this along, but decided that would be probably just make it more difficult, since not only would have to match them up perfectly, but also might have to resize them to fit the resolution I use. I've found it just easier to take all the screenshots collected when I get the random digsite and merge the images with a couple of clicks and points. Though I might just try anyway since my randomness of digsites is constantly sending me to Felwood... {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 00:50, 5 February 2011 (UTC)
-I am aware of all that, I was just pointing out the irony, we get to assist one of the most evil beings in the series. [[User:Hordesupporter|Hordesupporter]] 20:10, 27 March 2007 (EDT)
+::::I may well have documented all of some zones' digsites individually, I do not know.  If I have, you could ask for a full screenshot for calibration purposes.  Would save you creating them all anew in that limited case.  And ... you have much better image editing tools than I do. --[[User:Eirik Ratcatcher|Eirik Ratcatcher]] ([[User talk:Eirik Ratcatcher|talk]]) 01:01, 5 February 2011 (UTC)
-::I think that's the reason they did it. --[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 21:37, 27 March 2007 (EDT)
+==Question page and a petty thing==
-::: See, this is why Blizzard rock :) {{User:Kirkburn/Sig2}} 22:02, 27 March 2007 (EDT)
+Can i create a question page based on this thread http://www.scrollsoflore.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8471, just to see if i can gather a larger number of questions on this page? if i can, can you just give the name you think it's best?
+The petty thing is that i cannot remove the spaces between leaders and races in the infoboxes of the horde and the alliance, it wouldn't be a problem if it was in all of them, the problem is that some have spaces and other do not --[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 01:01, 25 January 2011 (UTC)
-:::: And ripping the story apart to make room for game mechanics is why they fall short. [[User:Legather|Legather]] 00:19, 2 August 2007 (UTC)
+:If you want, I think Scrolls of Lore is doing a pretty good job at it. I would make a forum post, under Warcraft Lore, rather than make an article... as for the name Dev Lore Questions would work fine. As for the infobox issue... don't think there is much you can do about that. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 02:11, 25 January 2011 (UTC)
-:::::Blizzard neither ripped apart the story nor did they fall short in this case. --[[User:Raze|Raze]] 00:26, 2 August 2007 (UTC)
+::I would prefer if it wasn't a forum page, because i want people to improve each other questions if possible, add points to the question or just rephrase it better--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 02:33, 25 January 2011 (UTC)
-LOL great point. Now what was the reason we helped Medivh (Sargeras) open the portal and let the Orcs in? Was it because we would need their help against the legion? But that's not really the case now is it? Azeroth would actually be a much nicer place if the Dark Portal was never opened.The obvious benefits would be that nothing the Orcs did would have happened, too many things that I'm not going to bring up. But also the Lich King would not exist if Ner'zhul would never make it to Azeroth. The scourge would never have existed and I'm sure that a bunch of other things wouldn't have happened if not a single Orc stepped on Azerothean soil. Of course the story wouldn't be as exciting if none of that happened :)
-[[User:Nathanmaxtro|Nathanmaxtro]] 02:28, 12 August 2007 (UTC)
+:::Would probably get more attention if on the forum, than a randomly named article. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 02:48, 25 January 2011 (UTC)
-Considering the legion, they would have found another way in, and the only race who would have prepared for such a thing would be the night elves, there would be no orcs to fight them, and the humans would have devolved into mindless civil wars, so the dark portal being opened is a neccesary evil. Furthermore, the bronze flight want to the timeline to be as accurate as possible, so they would probably be mostly un-concerned about what the demon orcs did before they were redeemed. [[User:Hordesupporter|Hordesupporter]] 04:48, 12 August 2007 (UTC)
-:It's a nice thought, isn't it? That Azeroth would be a much better place were the Dark Portal never opened? As you might recall, that's the same logic the Infinite Dragonflight used in that very instance when trying to convince you to turn back and let them kill Medivh.  And, of course, it's only telling one side of the story.  As Hordesupporter said, if the Dark Portal was never opened then the human nations would never have formed the Alliance and, instead, would have descended into civil war.  When the inevitable return of the Burning Legion came (because even without the Dark Portal, they would eventually find a way), the people of Azeroth would be woefully unprepared to fight them off, leading ultimately to a victory for the demonic hordes.  THAT is why the Dark Portal must be opened.  That is why the atrocities committed by the orcs must be allowed to happen, because in the end they lead to the salvation of Azeroth and the destruction of three of the most powerful and influential members of the Burning Legion (Mannoroth, Tichondrius, and Archimonde).  To quote Mr. Spock, "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few... Or the one." -- [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] 08:07, 15 September 2007 (UTC)
-Hmmm...Personally i don't believe the Burning Legion could have found another way to enter Azeroth. Just think for a second - it took Medivh's guardian power combined with the most destructive being ever in order the Dark Portal to be created, and we all know the guardian's power is almost as equal as Sargeras. If Medivh had been killed noone could have opened another Dark Portal. And also... why do you believe there was going to be a civil war anyway? Even if there was such a war it was going to be ten times better for the humans to go through it rather to watch their homeland turned into an undead paradise. No fall of Stormwind, noone could have killed king Llane, Dalaran and the Kirin Tor were going to be intact. Humanity is now ruled by a kid king and there are couple of survivors at Theramore island, and you are telling me the Civil War wasn't going to be better than this. But you are right, there is a high possibility the Alliance wouldn't have been made.. Who needs an Alliance when there are no foes? And about the slaying of Tichondrius and Archimonde, i remember Tichondrius being killed by Illidan and Archimonde by 10000 whisps (hah), not by the worthless Horde.--[[User:Grievous|Grievous]] 08:09, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
+::::It's just that in the forum, we can't change each other questions to improve them, in a article we can, and also to divide the discussion from the actual questions would be useful too--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 03:02, 25 January 2011 (UTC)
-The Civil War would have decimated the Human Race. The Bronze Dragons said so themselves that if the Orcs never came, the Alliance would never be formed. We can only trust the Bronze Dragons on that and considering the fact that the Dragons are Guardians of the World and Norzmordu could probably see to some level alternate timelines, we have to take their worlds for it.
-There are many ways for the Legion to return to the World. The Old Gods may be one way. The Sunwell may have the same effect as the Well of Eternity. The Demons could force their way in slowly. Besides, if Medivh died then, there would be no prophet to guide Azeroth to victory against any possible eventual return of the Legion. --[[User:InvincNerd|Invin Dranoel]] 13:28, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
+:Well i don't have time to set it up now that the round 2 started :P, anyway is there any page that has the Dev Lore answers saved and if not can i create one?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 02:04, 26 January 2011 (UTC)
-That may be true, but Medivh did die later and became the prophet. The same would have happened if he died earlier with only one difference - no Dark Portal, no orcs. I am pretty sure the Legion is going to find a way to come one way or another, but there are so many things that would have changed, so much stuff that is not going to happen... there is a connection between everything in WarCraft and to think we are talking about time travelling in WarCraft...Personally i think all peeps here said something true, because we may never know what would happen if the past is changed. That however doesn't change the fact that WoW players had to help Sargeras, which kinda sucks in a way...--[[User:Grievous|Grievous]] 00:39, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
+::[[Ask CDev]].--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 02:16, 26 January 2011 (UTC)
-== Betroathed? ==
+:::Thanks I guess we'll put round 2 below?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 02:35, 26 January 2011 (UTC)
-When was Sargeras betroathed to Ashara. That's nuts.<small>—The preceding [[WoWWiki:Signature|unsigned]] comment was added by {{User|Darkling235}}.</small>
+:[[User:Ashbear160/CDev Questions]] Here's the example i just need to find a way to do a format and i think it's good enough--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 00:39, 29 January 2011 (UTC)
-:Sign your posts, please. War of the Ancients, Azshara states about every chapter she appears in that Sargeras is her "intended." Admittedly, we don't know Sargeras's exact thoughts on the matter, but given Azshara's power, he was probably at least open to the idea. --[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 13:50, 12 April 2007 (EDT)
+::I don't think the format is very good but i have no further ideas, anyway what do you think, and can i turn it into a project page(i figured a project page would be a better page for a page with rules)?i also posted one question as a example of the format--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 00:57, 29 January 2011 (UTC)
-::Actually, pretty much everything from WotA points to this as nothing more than Azshara being delusional.  "She did not know, of course, that, in his infinite wisdom, the great one would make her Xavius's consort, but the councilor expected any protests to fade once their wondrous god informed her" (Well of Eternity p.205). There's also a passage from The Sundering that puts it pretty bluntly on p.269, regarding Azshara thinking that Sargeras is worthy to be her husband: "Not for a moment did Azshara question the sanity of her convictions.  She who had mesmerized her subjects was herself mesmerized by the lord of the Legion".  Illidan also wonders to himself whether Azshara actually believes that she's going to be Sargeras's consort, very much doubting that the notion fit into Sargeras's plan on p.221.  [[User:Zalera|Zalera]] 13:55, 9 May 2007 (EDT)
+:::I had a few ideas for this the other night, but forgot to write it down... I'll take a look at your example and get back to you in a bit. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 01:21, 29 January 2011 (UTC)
-:::Sargeras was never betrothed to Azshara, she was merely delusional, thinking that the demonlord, like everyone else, would be dazzled by her "perfection", such that she called him her intended without ever having spoken to him on the matter - Mannoroth's thoughts in the Sundering lead us to believe that Sargeras was aware of her intent and dismissed the idea out of hand.
+::::Err... so what do you think?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 12:41, 29 January 2011 (UTC)
-:::~[[User:Peregrine2976 | Peregrine]]
+:::::It's a good start, but I'm thinking about more details and adding a rating system as well. More on this later though. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 07:33, 31 January 2011 (UTC)
-==Traveling==
+:Hmm how would a rating system work?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 13:11, 31 January 2011 (UTC)
-I'm hesitant to ask this, as not much is known about the Titans and there isn't much evidence either way, but I've been curious about something. From the description of the Burning Legion in the WC3 manual, it sounds like the Titans went planet-hopping, going from world to world. But if this is the case, then why did Sargeras hang out in the Nether, waiting to be summoned?
+::A vote under every question? I personally do not like arbitrary rules unless absolutely necessary.--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 17:33, 31 January 2011 (UTC)
-On another note, is it explained exactly why Sargeras was able to come so easily to Azeroth to fight Aegwynn considering how much trouble it took to summon him in the War of the Acients? It is implied that the rip in time interferred with his summoning, but it still seems like his second coming was a pretty trivial matter. --[[User:Austin P|Austin P]] 13:43, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
+:::Yes i know it's with votes but i'm asking about the specific code--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 20:48, 31 January 2011 (UTC)
-In my opinion it's not Sargeras that Aegwinn killed in Northrend but an Avatar of him just like an Avatar of Hakkar is as easily as Hakkar the Soulflayer to kill. [[User:N'Nanz|N&#39;Nanz]] 15:05, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
-..."is as easily as"? You mean "is easier" or what?--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 15:17, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
+::::{{t|Vote}}? Though I do not see why someone could not just ask them all in the presumed next round.--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 20:53, 31 January 2011 (UTC)
+:::::Well in scrolls of lore it was done because some people prefer only to post the most popular questions
+No matter... it's not a voting system, simply a way to see how many users/players have a strong desire to know. I believe I have finished the layout for it, see '''User:Coobra/'''[[CDev questions]]. However, I'm undecided on which route to go with for the stars...
-oh... sorry! easier sure. I mean, maybe Archimonde too was summoned without his full powers, in fact he got killed by wisps that detonate on him (in wc3 this ability killed summoned units). What about? [[User:N'Nanz|N&#39;Nanz]] 15:31, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
+#[[Template:Rating/doc]] - Displays 5 full silver stars before switching to gold.
+#[[Template:Rating/dev/doc]] - Starts with one star from gray to gold, before going to star number 2.
+Number 2 will allow for easy expansion should more than 20 like the question, but I'm not sure if the style of it is that great. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 22:58, 31 January 2011 (UTC)
-I thought avatars were seperate from the original being. Even if Sargeras could exert his will through it, why would killing the avatar take out Sargeras as well? --[[User:Austin P|Austin P]] 02:22, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
+:You're good just one comment, you should add a Object sub-section While there are little questions in the scrolls of lore thread, it needs to be separated from Other--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 23:33, 31 January 2011 (UTC)
-Great point about the planet hopping maybe Sargeras forgot to take the keys to his ship when he left the Pantheon? :P Being that he is a Titan he should know full well how to get to Azeroth being that it is a planet his people had a hand in shaping. Unfortunately we don't know how the titans go from world to world and why Sargeras can't use the same method. [[User:Nathanmaxtro|Nathanmaxtro]] 02:35, 12 August 2007 (UTC)
+::Also this part should be added this bit of info
+:"Warcraft community to the ''Creative'' developers,"
+::Thanks--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 23:44, 31 January 2011 (UTC)
+:::I prefer [[Template:Rating/doc]]
+:::--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]]
+::::I prefer [[Template:Rating/doc]] too
+::::{{User:A'noob/sig}} 07:36, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
+:::::Very well, that was my first choice as well. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 22:26, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
-Shadows & Light indicates that the Titans fly from world to world. And don't forget that Sargeras left the Titans before they ordered Azeroth. [[User:Austin P|Austin P]] 20:28, 13
+:When we can start adding questions?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 22:21, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
-August 2007 (UTC)
+::It has been moved, feel free to. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 22:26, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
+:::I see questions there that have already been asked in Ask CDev round two. Why is this?--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 01:03, 2 February 2011 (UTC)
+::::They weren't answered yet? only when the questions gets answered is when they are removed, that's what's stated in the removing guidelines, also could anyone that has a wow account point people in the story forums to this article plz?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 01:06, 2 February 2011 (UTC)
+:::::If Blizzard's CDev team is feeling strangely generous, then it may become necessary to overhaul the article to avoid redundancy with answers that we will have gotten. All unanswered questions could be copied at a later date, as Blizzard did not delete the questions from last time immediately, they just un-stickied them. I could post a link to it on the Story Forums, if someone else does not do it first. I still think that it is a bit early.--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 01:13, 2 February 2011 (UTC)
-The explanation I had come up with are the following:
+:Last time it took a month this time i think it will take longer (more questions and all that shazz), besides i'm not adding the entire gigantic list i made on scrolls of lore, just those that interest me, just adding a little clutter so the article doesn't look so nude, i also think i'm doing this a bit too early but there are already people doing round 3 pratice runs (at least one guy stated to be doing that.)--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 01:23, 2 February 2011 (UTC)
-* The titans 'travelled' from world to world using a portal. Only the combined powers of most or all of the titans from the Pantheon were able to create a portal easily which they can travel. When Sargeras tried to enter Azeroth he did not had the aid of the other Pantheon titans however. So he resorted to using a spell created by his Warlocks.
+::Only posting your questions seems selfish. Also, clutter for the sake of clutter is stupid. I suppose I should post it on the Forum, if no one else has... unless it really is Rag's line. I may regret asking this, but why are there practice runs?--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 01:28, 2 February 2011 (UTC)
-The above can be proven in War of the Ancient. When Sargeras tried to enter Azeroth using a spell portal it was very dificult. But when the Legion had gained control of the Demon Soul. The portal was made a lot faster and stable. The Demon Soul was enpowered by the dragon Aspects who was in turn enpowered by the Pantheon Titans. It is easy to see how easy travelling between world would have been if there are other titans helping. The demon Soul contained the merest fraction of the titans power yet it enable the portal to  built so fast.
+:::I don't only post my questions, i post other questions the reason i post lots of mine is because, i was originally interested in them so i saved them, some of them i'm still interested, and i post them, some of them i'm not and i don't post them, also it's not just clutter for clutter sake, i'm genuinely interested in them.
-* Next theory is that titans have a indivisual sphere of power. Aman'Thul have the power of time as hinted when he grant Nozdormu a portion of his power. One other unknown titan within the Pantheon sphere of power is Space. Combined their power ascent that of Space Time and thus create a portal, a rift in Space Time, as easily as a wave of the two titans hands.
+:::why there are practice runs, i don't know, maybe to help people to not post stupid questions, it seems to be motivated by Omgdruid
+:::also Rag's line? i don't get it?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 01:37, 2 February 2011 (UTC)
+::::I took "i'm not adding the entire gigantic list i made on scrolls of lore, just those that interest me" as only posting questions that you have. If other people on Scrolls of Lore have other questions, then they should be saved too. If I misinterpreted, then I am sorry. I do not know about any "practice runs" but I will still post it anyway. "Rag's line" refers to Ragnaros yelling "TOO SOON!" It was a meme before there were mountains to remember people from! I dislike explaining jokes. EDIT: [http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2016081592#1 There] I posted it (unless Blizzard takes it down). Now stop bugging me. EDIT (again): Hmmm... Omgdruid says that you stole his idea... what am ''I'' to make of ''that''?--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 04:56, 2 February 2011 (UTC)
-When Sargeras attempted to enter Azeroth he did not have either of the above help. So it made the summonning process a lot longer. -- <small>—The preceding [[WoWWiki:Signature|unsigned]] comment was added by {{User|Tohjohn}}.</small>
+:Lol if you want you can tell him that i had have a dev lore question thread on the scrolls of lore forums since 07-04-2010, 01:11 AM, http://www.scrollsoflore.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7066&highlight=lore+questions, lol...
+:At that moment i wasn't posting many questions, just some to fill the thread a little--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 12:03, 2 February 2011 (UTC)
+== Metzen Possibly answered questions==
-The first one's a pretty good theory, although the Demon Soul's ability to strengthen the portal doesn't prove it. The DS was a very powerful artifact, and it wouldn't necessarily have needed the Titan's powers specifically to do the things it did. --[[User:Austin P|Austin P]] 23:57, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
+:No confirmations really, but if it's fake it's a '''VERY GOOD''' faker--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 16:40, 26 January 2011 (UTC)
-== Title ==
+http://4chanarchive.org/brchive/dspl_thread.php5?thread_id=84793174 (NSFW)
+:Besides an old forum post and a 4chan thread that you have to be logged in to see, I think that you mean [http://www.scrollsoflore.com/forums/showpost.php?p=259167&postcount=8584 this].--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 16:52, 26 January 2011 (UTC)
-Does anyone know if he had a title before he betrayed, and what was it?<small>—The preceding [[WoWWiki:Signature|unsigned]] comment was added by {{User|Rannulf}}.</small>
+::Tell me why, exactly, we're giving any credence whatsoever to something posted on 4chan? -- [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] ([[User talk:Dark T Zeratul|talk]]) 18:26, 26 January 2011 (UTC)
-:Something like 'Champion of the [[Pantheon]]'.--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 19:18, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
+:::Who is "we"?--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 18:34, 26 January 2011 (UTC)
+::::Yes you're link is much better, DTZ the point is that it's either metzen, or a very good impersonator, the emphasis on "Very good"--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 19:46, 26 January 2011 (UTC)
-== Sargeras=Melkor? ==
+:::::And given the source, I find the likelihood of it actually being Metzen to be infinitesimally small. It's not difficult for a good writer to impersonate someone in text.  -- [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] ([[User talk:Dark T Zeratul|talk]]) 20:14, 26 January 2011 (UTC)
+::::::It's still doesn't stop it from being very very good, i don't think this is metzen, but the probability is not infinitesimally small, or improbable--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 20:43, 26 January 2011 (UTC)
-Think about it. Lets draw some parallels
+:::::::<nowiki>*shrug*</nowiki> Believe what you will, then. Ultimately, what matters is that 4chan isn't a trustworthy source, so none of it is going on Wowpedia. -- [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] ([[User talk:Dark T Zeratul|talk]]) 20:50, 26 January 2011 (UTC)
+::::::::Never suggested that, probably going to archive it somewhere with my username tag--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 21:16, 26 January 2011 (UTC)
-*Most Powerful of the demiurgic entity
-*Started out good but after a period of time in darkness, was corrupted
-*Had a great war with an elven nation.
-*Brother to "leader" of non rouge equals
-[[User:Edanor|Edanor]] 22:10, 14 August 2007 (UTC)
+:I was bored [[User:Ashbear160/Archive]]--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 21:05, 29 January 2011 (UTC)
-:Melkor is based on an archetype in mythology; Lucifer, Set, and Eirlik, beings who existed as favored of the demiurge, but who ultimately Fell. Contrary to popular belief, Tolkien didn't just make all this stuff up, he drew on mythologies and archetypes that had existed for millenia. --[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 23:22, 14 August 2007 (UTC)
+== Gilneas Gallery ==
-::I know that Tolkien stole alot of his work, but if you take a look at the parallels, it's closest to tolkiens melkor then any mythology i could find [[User:Edanor|Edanor]] 02:02, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
+It will take me more time to upload all the small versions.Please do not delete all the ones I didn't reupload yet if I didn't finish till Sunday(Tommorow).[[Image:IconSmall_HighElf_Male.gif]] '''[[User:Sl2059|Aesindor, The Celestial Paladin]]'''  ([[User talk:Sl2059|Leave a Message]]) 19:44, 29 January 2011 (UTC)
-:::Apart from the war with the elves, I see most similarities to Lucifer or Iblis (in both cases, Michael is the non-rogue counterpart). I also notice that the Ainur were the "angels" to Eru's "God," while the Titans don't appear (at this time) to have that connection with a greater entity. As I said, the archetype is so old that it's a standard part of any story. Of course, the folks at Blizzard have read Tolkien (and likely other fantasy and original mythology), so to say there's no connection isn't right, either.
+: At long last,my great gilneas gallery is finished!!!! [[Image:IconSmall_HighElf_Male.gif]] '''[[User:Sl2059|Aesindor, The Celestial Paladin]]'''  ([[User talk:Sl2059|Leave a Message]]) 23:02, 4 February 2011 (UTC)
-:::To explain my apparent hostility, we had someone here a while ago trying to convince us that everything in Warcraft was ripped from Tolkien. While I'm certain that's not what you're trying to do, I'm wary of anyone who brings him up. --[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 02:45, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
-::::I don't even think that point is worth cosidering. Where do gnomes fit in to tolkiens work anyway? [[User:Edanor|Edanor]] 13:44, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
-Hobbits? Master of stealth and ability to get out of sticky situation? I agree with Ragestorm on this matter though it is hard not to draw parallels between any fantasy works and the Lord of the Rings. --[[User:InvincNerd|Invin Dranoel]] 11:56, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
-== Redemption ==
+== Photo Issue ==
+I'm having a problem with the file Aesindor.jpg,think you can help me? [[Image:IconSmall_HighElf_Male.gif]] '''[[User:Sl2059|Aesindor, The Celestial Paladin]]'''  ([[User talk:Sl2059|Leave a Message]]) 13:47, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
-Ive been thinking a thew moments ago... 1st I doubt Medive would be powerful enough to be able to see the future. 2nd a hell lot of the legion's high commanders have died resently. What if Sargeras wanted the Legion to get defeated! After the 1st invasion when the legion was defeated then. 9910 years later he seeked to destroy the Legion by wiping it out using one of the few planets the with stood its wrath! Azeroth. 1st he faiked a fight against the present gaurdien (Not Mdive his mother) while pregnant (PROVING WHY YOU shouldnt fight ultimate evils while having a heart attack/back injuries/pregnancy).
+:I'm guessing the issue was resolved, since the file does not exist. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 22:14, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
-In order to defeat the orcs properly the Allience couldnt of won in Stormwind other wise the Horde wouldnt have a foothlod on Azeroth. And the rest until the 7th war (Now remember there were 6 wars before that the war of the ancients that one with Cthun, the troll war, the 1st war, the second war) was completly random! And when Medive was revived so was Sargeras but he still posesed the not so young Gaurdien. Convinced the Warchief of the New Horde to travel to Kalimdor as well as later begging the Allience but only two nations ended up coming (The Gilneas and the Kultiras). He did plan to kill Cenaries since the Titan wanted to see the race with the exact same persanality as Garithos bitch (Ie the Night elves).
+== Old maps? ==
-So yeah Does my idea make any sence at all???--[[User:The last Alterac|The last Alterac]] 11:57, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
+While editing some articles I thought of how it would be nifty to use old world maps to compare old and new content. However, I can't seem to find them. Are they removed, or are their names just changed? [[User:WrathOfDeathfrost|WrathOfDeathfrost]] ([[User talk:WrathOfDeathfrost|talk]]) 14:52, 3 February 2011 (UTC)
-:No, I'm afraid it doesn't.
+:They were renamed. I believe -old was added to them, for the most part. You may wish to see [[Cataclysm map comparison]]. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 00:44, 4 February 2011 (UTC)
+::This is exactly what I was looking for! Thanks! [[User:WrathOfDeathfrost|WrathOfDeathfrost]] ([[User talk:WrathOfDeathfrost|talk]]) 13:11, 4 February 2011 (UTC)
+== Name ==
-:All of the source material states that Sargeras went insane and planned to undo all of the Titan's works. That alone disproves your theory. Sargeras also stated that he possessed Aegwynn because he didn't think he'd be able to stand up against her, so he opted for a more subtle approach. Assuming you're referring to Medivh's role in Reign of Chaos, it may not have been an exact prophecy, but a very accurate prediction. Medivh is incredibly knowledgeable and knows a lot about the demons. It's also been stated, in this very article, that Sargeras' spirit is floating around the Twisting Nether.
+I would like to return to Hallowseve15, Coobra. [[User:Hallowseve15|Hallowseve15]] ([[User talk:Hallowseve15|talk]]) 21:20, 10 February 2011 (UTC)
-:Several other things. Aegwynn wasn't pregnant when she faced Sargeras, you forgot the War of the Three Hammers and the troll empires war against the Qiraj, only a small group of Gilneasians joined Jaina and the Night Elves aren't comparible to Garithos. Garithos hates the High Elves because he was a racist. The Night Elves hate the High Elves because many of their ancestors were responible for the War of the Ancients, and yet they still practiced magic despite all of the trouble it's caused. --[[User:Austin P|Austin P]] 23:36, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
+==Icons==
-You only disproved one of my statements which I will now take back. (The part about her being pregnant)
- ''you forgot the War of the Three Hammers and the troll empires war against the Qiraj''  I didnt forget the Troll Empires War Against The Qira (I NEVER HERD OF IT) But the Three Hammers one involved the dwarven clans right (I forgot to mention that one)
-''Night Elves aren't comparible to Garithos. Garithos hates the High Elves because he was a racist. The Night Elves hate the High Elves because many of their ancestors were responible for the War of the Ancients, and yet they still practiced magic despite all of the trouble it's caused''
-THE NIGHT ELVES HATE Almost all of the other races because they are obnoctious and racist like Garithos. (play the Night elves campain in Rein Of Chaos and you will see how obnoctious the night elves are)...
-''All of the source material states that Sargeras went insane and planned to undo all of the Titan's works. That alone disproves your theory''
-What Im trying to say is maybe Sargeras was trying to undo his own work at the very end. Which his work was undoing the Titans work and now he is feeling remorse (GET IT?)
-'' Assuming you're referring to Medivh's role in Reign of Chaos, it may not have been an exact prophecy, but a very accurate prediction''  Yes it may not have been an exact prophacy. Maybe Sargeras gave him some intel on what is about to happen?
-'' It's also been stated, in this very article, that Sargeras' spirit is floating around the Twisting Nether.'' I never denied that--[[User:The last Alterac|The last Alterac]] 05:37, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
+How do you make the icons? is there any sort of turtorial or programs i need because i tried with wowhead and paint and the reults weren't good--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 19:58, 13 February 2011 (UTC)
-: In any case, this isn't a forum. {{User:Kirkburn/Sig4}} 12:05, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
+:I'd prefer the icon making just stay with a very few amount of users. Just so the quality and characteristics match between them. Not saying you'd be bad at making them or anything, but it just seems when ever a user (other than var or me) uploads an icon, one of us has to come in and clean it up. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 01:58, 14 February 2011 (UTC)
+::Ok managed to put the wmv working let me see if i can put it in photoshop and hit the correct sizes...--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 19:25, 15 February 2011 (UTC)
+::Now i'm having problems with photoshop...--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 21:40, 15 February 2011 (UTC)
+:::Photoshop can be fun, if not annoying sometimes. =P {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 21:42, 15 February 2011 (UTC)
+::::Not that kind of problem... it's more it requesting me for a serial number when it's supposed to be a trial(gosh i hope they weren't hoping of paying up for a trial), where did you get your photoshop?(or you rather not talk about it?)--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 22:12, 15 February 2011 (UTC)
+:Do the icons require any photoshop exclusive thing?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 22:20, 15 February 2011 (UTC)
+::Not to my knowledge. And trial's shouldn't need a serial number, supposed to be some sore of trial button or just skip something of the like to get passed that. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 02:52, 16 February 2011 (UTC)
+:::I'll have to use another photoshop-like tool that is free.--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 22:35, 16 February 2011 (UTC)
+:Hmm do you screenshot a large image, and make it small or the opposite?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 12:32, 17 February 2011 (UTC)
-There is no indication that he felt remorse. Sargeras' soul went into the Nether after Medivh was killed, so by saying that he was still with Medivh during the Third War denies that. And finally the night elves views have changed since the third war. Tyrande says herself that she misjuged them.--[[User:Austin P|Austin P]] 12:25, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
+::Large to small, too hard to work with small images. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 18:01, 17 February 2011 (UTC)
+::URGH IT'S HORRIBLE [[File:AkaliIcon2.png]]...
+::is there anyway to make the image more clear?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 23:22, 17 February 2011 (UTC)
+:Ok fixed the corner thing and the background thing what do you think?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 23:32, 17 February 2011 (UTC)
-But isnt it strange that so many of the Legion's leaders have died recently?? --[[User:The last Alterac|The last Alterac]] 00:01, 14 October 2007 (UTC)--[[User:The last Alterac|The last Alterac]] 00:01, 14 October 2007 (UTC)--[[User:The last Alterac]] 00:01, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
+::Looks blurry. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 23:45, 17 February 2011 (UTC)
+:::Do you know any specific tool to improve it? or any specific setting? or anything?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 23:47, 17 February 2011 (UTC)
+::::Just passing by (nothing mean) but even I you manage to do icons well, if they don't fit to be in the unique list, they will be removed from it ;)
-No. They were killed by the heroes of Azeroth. No big mystery there.--[[User:Austin P|Austin P]] 01:35, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
+::::{{User:A'noob/sig}} 23:50, 17 February 2011 (UTC)
+:Deities get unique icons even if they are not unique, anyway i think the problem is with taking the screenshot from wowmodel viewer with using the correct sizes--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 23:55, 17 February 2011 (UTC)
-== Aegwynn Vs Sargeras ==
+::I give up for today, first i uploaded with png, it was blurry, not with gif it gives me that it does match the MIME extension--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 00:12, 18 February 2011 (UTC)
-Quote from the main page: "Sargeras held back, letting the mage destroy his physical body".
+::''Deities get unique icons even if they are not unique''. Who made that rule? {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 05:48, 18 February 2011 (UTC)
-Is there any passage in the books to support that he actually threw the fight? Or was the transfer of his spirit into Aegwynn a last minute tactic? (I would normally check for myself, but I do not have my books handy). [[User:Crazy Diamond|Crazy Diamond]] 09:36, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
+:: The other deities have unique icons, even trough their models aren't any different.--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 13:25, 18 February 2011 (UTC)
+::Varghedin told me to use the sharpen tool to remove the blur, and it worked i think? is it still too blurry now?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 16:50, 18 February 2011 (UTC)
-I've heard much of that content was taken from official Warcraft Encyclopedia you might check it out.[[User:Baggins|Baggins]] 03:00, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
+== Vandalism ==
-In The Last Guardian, Sargeras states that he did indeed plan to place his spirit in Aegwynn's body, feeling that it was his best chance of beating her.--[[User:Austin P|Austin P]] 16:05, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
+Btw, Coobra, could you ban a user called [[User:Pcj|Pcj]], he deletes articles without reasons, I think it's already third time when he deletes one of the articles I'v made. Yours sincerely, --[[User:U7|U7]] ([[User talk:U7|talk]]) 03:17, 14 February 2011 (UTC)
-: "... Killing you was impossible, seducing you unlikely. So I made myself your heir." <ref>{{ref book |author= Grubb, Jeff |authorlink= Jeff Grubb |title= [[The Last Guardian]] |isbn= 978-0-6710-4151-9 |pages=249}}</ref>
+:Looking through the deletion logs... he's only deleted one article you created. And that was the one you just made today. Only other things I see deleted are redirects you made and a guild page that did not follow [[WP:GUILD]]. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 03:25, 14 February 2011 (UTC)
-: As I understand it, Sargeras was not capable to transport his whole being on Azeroth, for that to happen you need something like a Well of Eternity in magic power.
+::Okay, well could you do something? Why did he delite article [[pnagle's test dude]]? --[[User:U7|U7]] ([[User talk:U7|talk]]) 03:26, 14 February 2011 (UTC)
-: [[User:Montronax|Montronax]] 23:59, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
+:::I don't disagree with his actions for that page, and I'm sure had he not deleted it, another admin would have. I'm not sure where you got the image for that, but I'm sure it falls under [[DNP]]. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 03:29, 14 February 2011 (UTC)
+::::I don't see how it violates DNP, so could you please revert the deletion. The picture was taken from part of this old [http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/8095/1604/1600/WoWScrnShot_082504_104027.jpg screenshort]. --[[User:U7|U7]] ([[User talk:U7|talk]]) 03:35, 14 February 2011 (UTC)
+:::::Because it's from an illegal private server. -- [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] ([[User talk:Dark T Zeratul|talk]]) 04:09, 14 February 2011 (UTC)
+::::::Actually it isn't, the name is in small capitals because the character was just tested in alpha/beta, you can also find the characters ID on [http://db.mmo-champion.com/c/631/pnagles-test-dude/ DB-MMO], which proves that it has been on real servers . --[[User:U7|U7]] ([[User talk:U7|talk]]) 06:36, 14 February 2011 (UTC)
-== Lore issue? ==
+==Deities==
+:''Moved to [[Talk:Demigod#Deities]]''
+== IconSmall Worgen Icons ==
-I just read [[The Last Guardian]] ans I found some strange thing on the Sargeras page.
+About [[File:IconSmall_Worgen_Male.gif]] [http://eu.battle.net/wow/static/images/icons/race/22-0.gif] and [[File:IconSmall_Worgen_Female.gif]] [http://eu.battle.net/wow/static/images/icons/race/22-1.gif], i really don't get why you reverted my uploads. ALL the other playable races IconSmall images ([[File:IconSmall_Gnome_Male.gif]] and [http://eu.battle.net/wow/static/images/icons/race/7-0.gif], [[File:IconSmall_Draenei_Female.gif]] and [http://eu.battle.net/wow/static/images/icons/race/11-1.gif], etc) are *exactly* the same, both border and image. Why can't we use the official images for worgens (and goblins) too? [[File:IconSmall Guild Download.png|18px|< Download >|link=Guild:Download (Runetotem EU)]] [[User:Eraclito|<span style="color:#0C56A3;font-weight:bold">Eraclito</span>]] <small>( [[User_talk:Eraclito|Talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Eraclito|Edits]] )</small> 16:29, 24 February 2011 (UTC)
-Medivh's nature was thoroughly changed after his coma, and his closest friends and relatives noticed something was wrong. Medivh's mother Aegwynn, now banished from the realm for her misdeeds against the Order of Tirisfal, had figured out what Sargeras had done to her, and got into contact with King Llane and his general, Lord Lothar. Lothar felt he had no choice
-but to destroy the corrupted Medivh in order to prevent the evil Guardian from doing any more damage to Azeroth. Medivh's apprentice wizard, Khadgar, helped Lothar, King Llane and Aegwynn infiltrate Medivh's dark tower, Karazhan. Despite his enormous power, Medivh was caught off his guard, and was in the end killed by his former friends and comrades in his
-underground sanctum.
+:As I stated in the revert, you should check before blindly changing files.... All racial icons are placed on [[Wowpedia:List of creature icons]]. And as with the blood elves and goblins, worgen too have their place. They were reverted because you caused both file locations to be "official" icons, rather than how it was setup. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 22:50, 24 February 2011 (UTC)
-It seems like a quote from another source however pages 249 and 250 in The Last Guardian state that Aegwynn was tortured by Sargeras and left broken. And the book never place Llane or Aegwynn anywhere near [[Karazhan]] at the moment Sargeras/Medivh got killed by [[Khadgar]] and [[Lothar]] (The Last Guardian pages 299 and 300).
+::Okay, then: why is it the setup? I mean, we have icons matching all the playable races *except* worgen and goblin ones. For them, there're ''_2.gif'' like files. Why don't we delete the custom ones and only use the official ones, since they exist?
--- [[User:Montronax|Montronax]] 00:11, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
+::Anyway, thanks for updating my page :) But wasn't for my user page the reason i 'blindly changed' a custom icon used in templates with the official icon from battle.net. I tried to update something i though was missed by other people (like i recently did for some talents, abilities, other icons). But i feel just discouraged to help, if a change is considered vandalism without even a talk. [[File:IconSmall Guild Download.png|18px|< Download >|link=Guild:Download (Runetotem EU)]] [[User:Eraclito|<span style="color:#0C56A3;font-weight:bold">Eraclito</span>]] <small>( [[User_talk:Eraclito|Talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Eraclito|Edits]] )</small> 00:56, 25 February 2011 (UTC)
+:::Don't for discouraged, help is already greatly welcomed. The change you made was never considered vandalism just an overlook of what already existed. I can't speak for everyone, but I find many of the "official icons", especially the worgen ones, not that good. And what it really came down to was that icons that were being used first or the longest took the main name while newer ones took an alternate name. It's just keeping things constant as well and also very easy to switch between them as well:
+:::*{{t|Race|Worgen}} {{Race|Worgen}}
-:Thank you for your concern. The relevent passage has been corrected. --[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 00:53, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
+:::*{{t|Race|Worgen (playable)}} {{Race|Worgen (playable)}}
+:::*{{t|RaceIcon|Worgen|Male}}{{RaceIcon|Worgen|Male}}
+:::*{{t|RaceIcon|Worgen|Female}}{{RaceIcon|Worgen|Female}}
+:::*{{t|RaceIcon|Worgen2|Male}}{{RaceIcon|Worgen2|Male}}
+:::*{{t|RaceIcon|Worgen2|Female}}{{RaceIcon|Worgen2|Female}}
+:::Now... if you want to open a discussion about having the "official icons" moved to the main file name and have the other icons moved to an alternate name (which includes the worgen, blood elves, and goblin), then please open a discussion or maybe even open a vote on which icons would be preferred to have on the main slot. Things are always up for change. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 02:02, 25 February 2011 (UTC)
-::There have been multiple versions of who was involved at the time of Medivh's death (lothar and soldiers, just soldiers, and lothar, khadgar, and Garona, to name a few versions), but I can't think of any source stating Llane and Aegwynn were around at the time, so ya the correction was needed.[[User:Baggins|Baggins]] 18:28, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
+:::As for my reason of wanting the "official" icons pushed to the side simply because of their background... every icon we have uses a black background and theirs uses a blue for worgen and red for goblin. It really throws things off. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 02:04, 25 February 2011 (UTC)
-==Which One==
-I was skimming this article, and I didn't see what type of titan he is. I remembered he was a Vanir Titan, but I could be wrong. Which is he?
-&nbsp;[[Image:IconSmall HighElf Male.gif]]<span
-style="padding:0px; margin-left:0px; font-size:85%;">'''[[User:Mr.X8|<span style="color:#FF0000; cursor:hand" title="Welcome to My Nightmare..."> Mr.X8</span>]]'''</span><span style="padding:1px; font-size:85%;">&nbsp;[[User talk:Mr.X8|<font color="#DEB887" title="If you're going to bother me, you better have a good reason...">Talk</font>]] [[Special:Contributions/Mr.X8|<font color="#000000" title="Don't think of it as spam, think of it as me spreading my teachings">Contribs</font>]]</span> 22:58, 15 December 2007 (UTC)
+== 4.0.1 ==
-:Though I think is personality is more suited to a Vanir, the fact that he is Aman'Thul's brother implies he is an Aesir. We'll need an RPG citation for this one.--[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 15:35, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
+How are those pages datamined if the patch is on PTR? I am confused. [[User:Hallowseve15|Hallowseve15]] ([[User talk:Hallowseve15|talk]]) 02:33, 25 February 2011 (UTC)
-::Just checked, he's [[Vanir]]{{Cite|S&L|121}}.[[User:Baggins|Baggins]] 15:43, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
+:It's 4.1.0, and a patch being on the PTR doesn't mean everything being introduced in that patch has been released. If you do not have a source for things, there's nothing I can do. The same goes with your addition to Ragnaros.. MMO-Champion datamines this info and new models, but the new rag has not been seen and that falls under DNP. I believe we've told you this before many times. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 02:48, 25 February 2011 (UTC)
+== Forsaken History Content lack of BC ==
-:::Perhaps he's a half-brother, or else the Aesir/Vanir genetics are differnt than we thought. I also recall that he was described as bronze-skinned in the Wc3 Man. --[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 17:34, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
+history Content lack of BC lore if i recall RAS members had huge role trying find cure for the fel orcs should someone add forsaken role in BC i don't have time do it right now. <small>—The preceding [[Wowpedia:Signature|unsigned]] comment was added by {{User|Forsakenlord}}.</small>
+:K ... ? Random comment is random. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 00:21, 27 February 2011 (UTC)
+::sorry but i wanted ask could you add forsaken role on History BC content because i am really busy and don't have time to read BC quests.--[[User:Forsakenlord|Forsakenlord]] ([[User talk:Forsakenlord|talk]]) 01:18, 27 February 2011 (UTC)
+:::Seems to be your project.. I have a bunch of stuff I am already doing myself, so I don't have the time to do things for you such as going through all the old BC content. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 01:49, 27 February 2011 (UTC)
+==Corporeal and Incorporeal Undead ==
+* [[Incorporeal creature]]
+* [[Corporeal creature]]
+Could you help me make those 2 articles? that is if you don't have problems with making them. i also have doubts on the names probably should think off a better one.--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 20:47, 2 March 2011 (UTC)
+:Hmm.. it's probably good for a general term, could probably drop creature from it and just make [[Incorporeal]] / [[Corporeal]] articles. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 01:12, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
+::It's just to contrast better with the [[Skeletal creature]] article that contains rpg data--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 01:32, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
+:::Also could you tell em what you think of what i've been updating the creature template and the creature articles([[Undead]] and [[Elemental]])--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 01:47, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
+::::i also found this article that can be used for all [[Mechanized animal]] so i added a list there--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 02:47, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
+:::::Could you merge the [[Rumbling exile]] and the [[Rumbling Exile]] pages?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 14:22, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
+I dislike such needless classification. Also, why merge the pages? They are not necessarily the same. It could be a type of earth elemental that just shares its name with only one mob. Or, it could be about the mob.--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 19:00, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
+:Which are both earth elementals, it's like saying that Apple pie and Apple Pie aren't the same thing.--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 20:08, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
+::No. It is ''possibly'' like saying that all murlocs are [http://www.wowhead.com/npc=285 Murlocs]. However, it is very borderline in this case.--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 20:12, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
+:::Not to mention that in the section they are said to inhabit [[Deepholm|Deephome]]. --{{User:Gourra/Sig2}} 20:16, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
+::::All earth elementals are from deepholm, they are summoned to azroth you know -.-, and about that SWM this has been done before let me just look for a example --[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 21:06, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
+:::::Ok i'm almost giving up, i wanted to make the rpg articles that have little information merged with others with the same information, but it's just a big mess, the [[Quilboar thornweaver]] and the [[Thornweaver]] article state almost the same, the molten giant article are two one for the background and the other for the mob+background, and a thousand more problems with rpg articles i might as well make a list of problems i see... because... this is leaving me confused...--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 22:15, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
-::Yes, the Vanir are bronze-skinned titans{{Cite|S&L|109}},and Sargeras was, "a noble giant of molten bronze", "His eyes, hair and beard erupted in flames and his bronze, metallic skin split open to reveal an endless furnace of hate and flame.{{Cite|W3Man|77, 78}} according to Warcraft III manual. Other than Vanir and Aesir being considered seperate subspecies of Titan, we don't know much about the race's genetics at all, :p.[[User:Baggins|Baggins]] 05:43, 19 December 2007 (UTC)
+So nobody has any solutions?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 14:55, 13 March 2011 (UTC)
-==Dark titan==
-Is there a reason why dark titan is capitalized in this article? I've been looking and only find the term in lower case throughout the sources.[[User:Baggins|Baggins]] 05:38, 19 December 2007 (UTC)
+:To what, specifically?--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 19:20, 13 March 2011 (UTC)
-:No idea. TFT, when Drak'Thul references him? It seems more a title to me. --[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 21:06, 19 December 2007 (UTC)
+::the 2 Molten giant articles is it supposed to be two articles, one about mob+background and another on the background or one mob article and one background article.
-Ahh, in other sources its lower case, while it still appears to be a title, seems to be used almost as a racial designation. I'll look into listing references where it appears if I get the time.[[User:Baggins|Baggins]] 06:15, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
+::Also the thornweaver and quillboar thronweaver should be merged and the goblin tinker(not the unit article) and the tinker article should also be merged.--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 20:19, 13 March 2011 (UTC)
+:::The two molten giant articles are two articles: [[Molten giant]] and [[Molten Giant]]. The two thornweaver lore pages should probably be merged, but I am not sure to what name. About the tinkers, not all tinkers are goblins, and goblins are often their own sort of tinker.--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 20:30, 13 March 2011 (UTC)
+:the quillboar thornweaver article should be under Thornweaver races section in the thornweaver article i think.
-Well in W3Man its lower case dark, and upper case T, but this was back when Titan was a proper noun, later sources made it a lower case race name.;
+:The Tinker class has a section for Tinker races, and it has only gnome in it, goblin tinker should be put under there.
-:...the dark Titan’s vast rage and power"{{fact}}<!-- Cited as 78 - but what page? -->
+--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 20:50, 13 March 2011 (UTC)
+:Do you have any problems if i merge those two?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 13:42, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
+::Which two? You mentioned more than two pages. The thornweaver pages could be merged, I guess, but I might need to clean the merged page later. I appreciate your enthusiasm.--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 19:04, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
-:...the dark Titan’s will.{{cite|W3Man|79}}
+::I meant merge both the thornweaver with the quilboar thornweaver, and the tinker with goblin tinker.--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 19:14, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
-Apparently the WoW manual, has it capitalized;
-:...the island dungeon rumored to hold the remains of the Dark Titan, Sargeras...claim the Dark Titan’s remains.{{cite|WoWMan|162, 163}}
+:::Merged the articles, i'm going to put the other with a delete tag, and the goblin tinker article contains irrelevant and repeated information which makes me think this information is copied from the source, i didn't pass the languages the quillboar thornweaver speaks because i think that information is irrelevat.--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 19:22, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
-The Warcraft RPG, spelled dark titan lowercase;
+::::There is nothing wrong with leaving things as redirects. There is nothing wrong with coping information from sources, barring fair use issues, as that means that it is accurate.--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 19:31, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
-:Sargeras, the dark titan and lord of the Burning Legion,{{cite|WRPG|20}}
+:::::I thought it was wiki standards that useless articles were deleted and that information must not be directly copied unlss stated as such?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 19:41, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
+::::::What are you interpreting? Cite it.--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 19:42, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
-Magic & mayhem uses "dark titan", lower case, and implies that there are other dark titans than just Sargeras;
-Magic is a literal gateway drug that allows dark titans such as Sargeras to bring evil influences to the world.{{cite|M&M|16}}
+:i don't know, i just thought it was, anyway you rversed what i did in the thornweaver article :(, and used the quilboar article instead...--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 19:43, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
-In Shadows & Light, its always lower case;
+:I think the Thornweaver article was slightly better written than the quilboar one, also i don't think the language information is relevant--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 19:47, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
-:...to claim the dark titan’s powers for himself...Archimonde serves as general and overlord for the dark titan’s armies...Mannoroth was the barbaric leader of the Pit Lords when the dark titan Sargeras subjugated them and bent them to his will.{{Cite|S&L|39, 59, 61}}
+::The one who reverted it was me because 1) there's only one type of thornweaver 2) the section was a duplicate of the information that already was in the article. --{{User:Gourra/Sig2}} 19:48, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
-So perhaps it is used as both a title, and a 'race term'?
---[[User:Baggins|Baggins]] 09:54, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
+:::I told you to read our policies and guidelines. Do it. You know you want to. All I did to the quilboar article was remove the delete tag that you put, as it was the wrong one.--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 19:55, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
-:I can see both happening. Since he isn't  really a Vanir any more, they're using dark titan as a racial, but on the other hand, since he's the only dark titan we know of it's also being used as a title. --[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 15:06, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
+::::There are too many policies and guidelines, this is the sole reason why i don't bother to read them unless someone points me there, and what i'm saying is that Thornweaver article was slightly better written than the Quillboar thornweaver article.--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 21:07, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
-::Well he's still apparently a Vanir, but he's a very corrupt Vanir, according to Shadows & Light.[[User:Baggins|Baggins]] 07:42, 21 December 2007 (UTC)
+:::::Admitting that you haven't read the policies is probably not the wisest course of action, and your reasoning is not a good excuse. -- [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] ([[User talk:Dark T Zeratul|talk]]) 21:11, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
+::There are like 50 pages of it, i just don't have the patience--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 21:23, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
+:::Hmm... what do you think, Coobra?--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 02:51, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
-:::Well, If one looks at pure metallurgy, I'm pretty sure he's not bronze anymore. --[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 16:20, 21 December 2007 (UTC)
+::::I'm not sure what the question is... about the mergings? Or about reading the policies/guidelines? {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 03:46, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
-::LoL, well he was described as being molten bronze with split open skin, when he was fully corrupted in Warcraft III manual.[[User:Baggins|Baggins]] 20:13, 24 December 2007 (UTC)
+:::::Either, though I frown more on the latter. It is your talk page. It is sort of ironic that you are uninvolved.--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 04:01, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
-== Illidans Eyes ==
+::::::Besides the thornweaver articles, I see no reason for the others to be merged... though [[goblin tinker]] is a small article, it could be merged into [[tinker]] with a redirect. I'll have no issue with that. But a no for the molten giant articles. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 04:10, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
-I recently finished Sundering, and I noticed something about Illidan's new Eyes serving Sargeras as well.  Could he see through Illidan's eyes.  His words say yes, his actions, or lack thereof say no.  Any clarification? ([[User:Meneldir|Meneldir]] 02:08, 11 January 2008 (UTC))
+:I'm not asking the molten giant articles to be merged, trough one should probably be moved to Molten giant(mob), i had a confusion, because one was supposed to be mob and another background, but the mob article i rmebered it to have lot of background i must have remembered it wrong, the thing with the rumbling exile, is because the background article has very little information that could be merged with the mob article, that's all.--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 17:19, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
-== Weapons ==
-would anyone happen to know if the bleeding spear wielded by the avatar has a name?it was the first mentioned weapon of his....why is it nameless? (i think the sword was added because swords are the main weapon in all games, there arn't legendary spears)[[User:Baldr|Baldr]] 03:55, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
-I have wondered about the spear too. Why didn't the avatar wield [[Gorribal]]? [[User:Xavius|Xavius, the Satyr Lord]] 13:33, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
+::I merged the tinker articles, i don't know how to turn the goblin tinker article into a redirect.--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 17:23, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
+:::I should've sayed this but what i want is to make RPG information more accessible, it's very hard to find it when most of it, is separated from the rest of the content, when many connections can be made.--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 18:58, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
-:Because the avatar might not have been him, but just a projection of him.[[User:Baggins|Baggins]] 18:28, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
+::::There's {{t|WoW RPG classes}} and {{t|Warcraft RPG classes}} already, what else do you need? --{{User:Gourra/Sig2}} 18:59, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
-I dunno but i've never eally heard of a legendary spear, in every game if there is a huge weapon of doom then its a sword(exept for doomhammer) [[User:Baldr|Baldr]] 05:16, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
-: What about javelins of Surmanar. Those would be legendary and spearish. [[User:Geeko|Geeko]] 06:28, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
+:::::It's not about classes, those two classes were just 2 good examples i found that conventionally had classes, two examples that i also found was [[Acid bullet]] and [[Drill crawler]] which i linked to the dark iron clan article, just making these articles more accessible or transfer the information to the appropriate place--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 19:22, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
-:: Something tells me Sargeras-- avatar or person --wouldn't be caught dead wielding something as dainty and full of elaborate Highborne craftsmanship as one of those, and would much rather carry a big, foreboding weapon decorated with humanoid skulls that pulses with fel energies and spews gouts of blood at things.  --[[User:Super Bhaal|Super Bhaal]] 19:41, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
-::: I wasn't saying Sargeras was wielding them i was just replying to the comment above about how a Legendary spear doesn't sound like it exists. But what you said about Sargeras is true. [[User:Geeko|Geeko]] 01:14, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
+:Is there a category for non-cooking(as in not in the profession) cuisine?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 19:40, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
+::[[:Category:World of Warcraft food items]]. --[[User:Eirik Ratcatcher|Eirik Ratcatcher]] ([[User talk:Eirik Ratcatcher|talk]]) 20:23, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
+:::I don't think i can't put things like [[Amity wine]] there can't i...--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 20:34, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
+::::Items that don't appear in WoW can be placed into [[:Category:Items]]. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 20:53, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
+:::::Thanks that's what i was looking for.--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 21:09, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
+==Template:Creature==
+I updated the creature template and template footers what do you think?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 14:55, 13 March 2011 (UTC)
+:Thanks for fixing those problems :D--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 22:04, 15 March 2011 (UTC)
+::Your welcome. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 22:34, 15 March 2011 (UTC)
+:::Now i'm going to try to make a template for every tribe and clan per race.--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 23:01, 15 March 2011 (UTC)
+::::For some reason i can't edit templates that i already started...--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 23:12, 15 March 2011 (UTC)
+:::::You can, you just had them misnamed under the name parameter.{{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 00:52, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
+:I also can't make a broken template because broken is already a tag? which name do i use Broken tribes?
+::Just use Broken draenei. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 00:54, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
+:::Ok i'll do it tomorrow if nobody else has done it.--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 00:56, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
+::::Ok i think all types of racial groups are done?--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 18:51, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
+==Joren Ironstock==
+Is there a specific guideline other than the boilerplates that I'm supposed to follow here? I am a new contributer, and I'm just learning all the guidelines. Is there a reason not to include the quest objective in a literate way under the quest header for NPCs? And sorry for the multiple edit updates; I am new, as mentioned, and will get better over time. If there is a problem with the way I'm expanding stubs please let me know, I wouldn't want to anger imposing members of the community who know all about account hacking and whatnot :) Thanks [[User:Thewalrus|Thewalrus]] ([[User talk:Thewalrus|talk]]) 07:19, 17 March 2011 (UTC)
+:Other than our normal [[Wowpedia:Guidelines]], [[Wowpedia:Policies]], and using the boilerplate layout just look to similar articles for examples. Though I would use newer articles for the best examples on how we'd like articles to start appearing, older articles will tend to look as they were wanted years ago. Feel free to experiment in [[Wowpedia:Sandbox|sandboxes]] as well, these are generally not monitored and allow users to freely try things without interfering with existing articles and preventing edit errors (if another user starts to edit the same article). Welcome to wowpedia. =) {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 05:07, 18 March 2011 (UTC)
+==[[Organization]]==
+I redid the alliance and horde sections, and changed it for instead of being race by race, to be by jurisdiction or sovereignty, i want to ask your opinion, i'll redo the rest tomorrow.--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 02:36, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
+== Images from wowhead ==
+Hello! I was searching images for some NPCs, but I can't find them because they are present only during some events. I found that wowhead has the images, can i upload them or it's forbidden? -- '''[[User:Forco|<span style="color:#6495ed">Forco</span>]]''' ''[[User talk:Forco|<small><span style="color:lightblue;">sussura agli abissi</span></small>]]'' 20:37, 24 March 2011 (UTC)
+:Yes, you can upload those images to Wowpedia. --{{User:Gourra/Sig2}} 20:38, 24 March 2011 (UTC)
+::Ok, thanks :) -- '''[[User:Forco|<span style="color:#6495ed">Forco</span>]]''' ''[[User talk:Forco|<small><span style="color:lightblue;">sussura agli abissi</span></small>]]'' 20:40, 24 March 2011 (UTC)
+==Priesthood of elune==
+Someone joined a lot of priests of elune articles, but then named it [[Priests and priestesses of Elune]], but isn't priesthood of elune a more correct gender neutral name, i tried to change it but it says i can't.--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 13:57, 27 March 2011 (UTC)
+:Merging the two is misleading as they are two different terms. --{{User:Gourra/Sig2}} 14:07, 27 March 2011 (UTC)
+::Well since vanilla wow the priesthood has been gender neutral amplified by the fact of the two statues in archaeology that tell us that, but i don't really care much of it.--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 14:11, 27 March 2011 (UTC)
+==Dragonflight footer==
+I'm trying to create a dragonflight footer, but i seem to be doing something wrong because i can't get the Red dragonflight to appear on it's page...--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 22:50, 27 March 2011 (UTC)
+::I ran out of ideas on how to make this work
+::nevermind i'm a moron--[[User:Ashbear160|Ashbear160]] ([[User talk:Ashbear160|talk]]) 23:09, 27 March 2011 (UTC)
+== Racial organization templates ==
+Do you have anymore thoughts on [[Forum:Racial organization template naming|this]]? I feel it just comes down to what Lon-ami and Ashbear160 want to enforce. Also, do you believe that [[User:Ashbear160/Organization templates|this]] is a bit extreme? It has been a pet peeve of mine for a while (pre-Rolandius even) that all mob prefixes and suffixes do not need pages, which may happen, and some people (myself, for now, not included) are not too crazy about navboxes.--{{User:Sandwichman2448/Sig}} 20:05, 30 March 2011 (UTC)
+:Hmm... it does seem to be getting excessive, cause not everything needs to be in the navbox... but it's like you said in the forum post, things get messy over periods of time. {{User:Coobra/Sig4}} 21:04, 30 March 2011 (UTC)